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HomeMy WebLinkAbout2024.0618.TCRM.Minutes
TOWN OF FOUNTAIN HILLS
MINUTES OF THE REGULAR MEETING OF THE FOUNTAIN HILLS TOWN COUNCIL JUNE 18, 2024
A Regular Meeting of the Fountain Hills Town Council was convened at 16705 E. Avenue of the Fountains in open and public session at 5:26 p.m.
Members Present: Mayor Ginny Dickey: Vice Mayor Brenda J. Kalivianakis; Councilmember Gerry Friedel; Councilmember Peggy McMahon; Councilmember Sharron Grzybowski; Councilmember Hannah Toth; Councilmember Allen Skillicorn
Staff Present: Town Manager Rachael Goodwin; Town Attorney Allen Quist; Town Clerk Linda Mendenhall Staff Absent: Town Attorney Aaron D. Arnson
Audience: Approximately fifty members of the public were present.
TOWN OF FOUNTAIN HILLS
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Post-Production File
Town of Fountain Hills
Town Council Regular Meeting
June 18, 2024
Transcription Provided By:
eScribers, LLC
* * * * *
Transcription is provided in order to facilitate communication accessibility and may not
be a totally verbatim record of the proceedings.
* * * * *
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MAYOR DICKEY: And now we'll call our regular meeting to order. Please stand for the
pledge and remain standing for the invocation.
ALL: I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic
for which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
MAYOR DICKEY: Thank you. You may know that the Rev. Bobby Brewer sadly passed
away this week. Poignantly, he was actually scheduled for tonight's invocation. So we
asked his good friend and former Councilman Dennis Brown to please do the honors.
MR. BROWN: And thank you, Mayor and Council.
Before we pray, I'd like to give just a minute for Bobby Brewer, if I may. Bobby and I
were good friends. He's a man of God. We traveled to Argentina. Actually built a
church -- a sticks-and-bricks church in Argentina. And my last term, he actually swore
me in. So he was a very important person in our lives. So let us pray, please.
Father God, thank you for the opportunity to live in such a wonderful, beautiful town.
Thank you for blessing the citizens of Fountain Hills with a group of hardworking,
dedicated, caring group of town employees and first responders. Without this group,
we would not have a beautiful town to be blessed with. Father, thank you for the
mayor and the council. I pray you will bless each of our town officials with the
knowledge and strength to keep our town moving forward, as we have been blessed
with all the previous councils. I pray to you, Father God, through the Holy Spirit. In
Christ Jesus' name, Amen.
MAYOR DICKEY: Thank you, Dennis.
UNIDENTIFIED SPEAKER: Thank you.
MAYOR DICKEY: Thank you, Judy.
MR. BROWN: Thank you.
MAYOR DICKEY: Of course. Roll call, please.
MENDENHALL: Mayor Dickey?
MAYOR DICKEY: Here.
MENDENHALL: Vice Mayor Kalivianakis?
VICE MAYOR KALIVIANAKIS: Here.
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MENDENHALL: Councilmember Friedel?
FRIEDEL: Present.
MENDENHALL: Councilmember McMahon?
MCMAHON: Here.
MENDENHALL: Councilmember Grzybowski?
GRZYBOWSKI: Present.
MENDENHALL: Councilmember Toth?
TOTH: Present.
MENDENHALL: Councilmember Skillicorn?
SKILLICORN: Here.
MENDENHALL: Anyone wishing to address the council regarding items listed on the
agenda or under Call to the Public should fill out a request to comment card located in
the back of the council chambers and hand it to the town clerk prior to consideration of
that agenda item. When your name is called, please approach the podium, speak into
the microphone, and state your name for the public record. Please limit your comments
to three minutes. It is the policy of the mayor and council to not comment on items
brought forth under Call to the Public. However, staff can be directed to report back to
the council at a future date or to schedule items raised for a future council meeting.
MAYOR DICKEY: Thank you, Linda. We'll start, as always, with our activities. We'll start
with our town manager and then we'll go to this other side.
GOODWIN: Mayor, thank you. I just had a couple of quick updates. I don't generally
talk about the meetings we have attended. As we all know, we all serve in different
capacities with MAG, but I did want to mention that the manager's meeting was last
week, and we had an opportunity -- and MAG is developing a new offshoot for small
communities, for communities less than 40,000 in population, to talk about their unique
needs and ways that they can better help smaller communities leverage the abilities and
the magnitude of MAG. So that's a really exciting new thing that Fountain Hills will be
part of, so I'm excited to be involved in that.
I also wanted to mention that it's hot. If you hadn't noticed, it's really hot. So our
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splash pad is a super popular place. I want to encourage folks, our splash pad reminder,
that it's open seven days a week. It opens at 9 a.m. and then runs till dusk. It has been
a very popular place. It's a great place to take family, friends that are visiting. And it
was actually featured on national TV last night, so that was very neat. Obviously, they
were talking about the heatwave that is moving across the country, ways to stay cool,
but it was really neat to see our splash pad featured in that way. So other ways to stay
cool, our Wacky Wet Wednesday is this Wednesday out at Four Peaks Park. Our fire
department will be out there. A number of games and activities and all kinds of
sprinklers will be going to help cool off. Later in July, we also have our Ice Cream Social,
and then of course we have our 4th of July activities. So for a full list of things, please
hop onto our website, follow us on social media to find out all the activities going on in
town during the summer. That's my update.
MAYOR DICKEY: Thank you.
Councilman Skillicorn?
SKILLICORN: No report other than just a thank you everyone for coming and wishing
everyone a healthy, happy summer.
MAYOR DICKEY: Councilwoman?
VICE MAYOR KALIVIANAKIS: Thank you, Ms. Mayor. Yeah. Like Allen said, thank you,
everybody, for coming. Thank you for the people live streaming on YouTube and Cox
Channel 11; we appreciate your participation. Like I say every council meeting, an active
and engaged citizenship leads to good government. What do I mean by that? Active
citizens participate in things like public meetings, social groups, committees, and
councils; active citizens help their society by helping others; active citizens engage and
assist with their neighbors; active citizens speak out against prejudice, injustice, and
inequality.
I had the honor and privilege to attend the Length of Service Luncheon for our
employees, which was a really wonderful event. They -- we rewarded the length of
service: 5, 10, 15, 20 years; you get the drift. Long-term employees contribute to the
stability and the reliability of our town. Their extended tenure demonstrates loyalty,
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commitment, and a proven track record of consistently delivering results. This stability
translates into reduced risks and increased confidence in our town's ability to fulfill its
commitments. Long-term employees possess solid institutional knowledge enabling
them to navigate challenges, maintain continuity, and provide a dependable foundation
for all collaborative efforts. Thank you all of our town employees. I wish we could have
recognized every one of you, as it was only one in the 5, 10, 15 years, but you all
deserve recognition. So thank you for serving this town.
We had another Public Safety, Military, and Courts Committee meeting this week. If
you remember -- I think it was a month ago -- we discussed the bio-divergent [sic]
people that are on the spectrum with autism and other neurological illnesses. When
they get police stops, sometimes those police stops go terribly wrong simply because
the people don't process the information while they're being stopped; sometimes they
panic. And so our committee recommended either legislatively or administratively that
this information gets put on their driver's license. So when they do a traffic stop, the
officer will know that this person has a bio-divergent [sic] problem. And so the good
news is, is -- the big win is that didn't have to go legislatively; this one administratively --
the Arizona Department of Motor Vehicles warmly embraced it and they're going to roll
out a test project very soon. And so that's that's a wonderful thing that our committee
did.
The other thing that we did this last week is on public records requests. Like FOIA
requests, the victims and witnesses of crimes don't have their names protected. They
protect things like their email, Social Security, address, phone number, and other things
like that, but they don't protect their name. And so can you imagine if you're a witness
to a crime -- say, a cartel crime, and the cartel actually does a FOIA request on who the
witnesses were to that crime, and they turn over the name. That's just crazy. And so
our committee voted unanimously to end that loophole so that that information will be
protected from FOIA requests. So that's another very good thing.
I also attended the annual Elks Club Annual Flag Day Celebration. I am proud myself to
be an elk. It's noteworthy that the Benevolent and Protective Order of Elks is the first
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and only fraternal body to require formal observance of Flag Day, which came about
during the Grand Assembly at Dallas, Texas, in 1908. This is one of the reasons it is so
meaningful to me as an elk. Flag Day is a holiday in the United States that celebrates the
adoption of our national flag. The day also honors the principles of freedom, of unity,
and of patriotism. The stars on the flag represent the 50 states. The stripes represent
the original 13 colonies. The colors have meaning as well. The red symbolizes hardiness
and valor; the white symbolizes purity and innocence; and the blue represents vigilance,
persistence, and justice. And so that was a wonderful event. I was really glad to go
there.
Lastly, our Desert Valley Winds, the band I play for, is going to be returning to Fountain
Hills soon, so stay tuned. I'll have more information for you shortly. So anyway, that's
my report. Thank you, Ms. Mayor.
MCMAHON: Good evening, everybody, and thank you for coming. Past couple weeks, I
have attended a couple of committee meetings with the Arizona League of Cities and
Towns. We're looking forward to the future, making some suggested policy decisions,
which are going to come before the conference in August for decision or not, whether
they're going to submit it to the legislature or not. That's it.
MAYOR DICKEY: So thank you. Thanks.
FRIEDEL: Thank you, Mayor.
Rachael brought up the splash pad. I was out there last week; it was packed. So it's
great to see that it's getting so much use. And it's such a wonderful thing for our
community and to be able to offer that to the public. I also attended the Length of
Service Luncheon for the town employees, and I still consider the town employees to be
our most valuable asset because we couldn't run the town without them. So thank you
to everybody that was recognized and thank you to all the employees that work for the
town.
I was also at the Elks Lodge Flag Ceremony. It was a very moving ceremony and a lot of
history about our flag and what it represents to everybody in this nation. So I was proud
to be a part of that ceremony.
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And I attended the domestic violence meeting, and we talked a lot about domestic
violence later in life. Most people don't think about that, but it does happen. Late life
domestic violence is a real thing, and so we're forming a committee to look into some
other alternatives for that as well. So that's all I have. Thank you.
MAYOR DICKEY: Thank you.
GRZYBOWSKI: I attended the Charge at Work Webinar sponsored by the Arizona
Women of Electric Vehicles and the EV program manager with the City of Phoenix. They
asked me if I would help them coordinate a Ride-and-Drive here in Fountain Hills, so I
told them that we'd talk about it. SRP does that regularly all around the valley.
I also attended the League's Budget, Finance, and Economic Development Policy
Committee meeting. We unanimously approved two items to send to the League's
Resolution Committee at the Annual League Conference. The first one is protecting
local revenue, and the second one is regarding the tax increment financing. It's a tool
that cities and towns get to use in every other state. We are the only state that cannot
use this. And in case you're not familiar with TIF, it's where taxes on future land values
are used to pay for new development and infrastructure inside a designated TIF district.
Thank you.
MAYOR DICKEY: Thank you.
TOTH: Thank you. I have no report this week, but happy summer everyone and stay
cool.
MAYOR DICKEY: Thank you. Yes, were very happy to go to the Length of Service
Recognition; appreciate our staff, of course.
Had my quarterly meeting with Dr. J., superintendent, and some of our staff met with
him as well. So I think we had some good things coming up with the school district.
And MAG Regional council meets next week, and that this is our annual meeting where
we have a changing of the executive committee and the chair. So I don't know who that
is yet, but I'll know next time.
We have a couple of things going on. We have a proclamation for Parks and Rec
Month -- I'm thinking that's going to be Kevin -- and then outgoing Commissioner Susan
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Dempster. So I'll go down for those and then we'll come up and do a couple more
things. So we'll start with the Parks and Rec proclamation. Hold on.
All right. So whereas Parks and Rec are an integral part of communities throughout the
country, including the Town of Fountain Hills; and, whereas Parks and Recreation
promote health and wellness, improving the physical and mental health of people who
live near parks and time spent in nature; and, whereas Parks and Rec encourage physical
activities by providing space for popular sports, hiking trails, and many others designed
to promote active lifestyles; whereas Parks and Rec is a leading provider of healthy
meals, nutrition services, and education such as out-of-school time programing, youth
sports and environmental education critical to childhood development; and whereas,
Parks and Rec increase the community's economic prosperity through higher property
values, expansion of the local tax base, increased tourism and attraction, and retention
of businesses, and crime reduction; and whereas Parks and Rec are fundamental to the
environmental well-being of our community and our essential and adaptable
infrastructure that make our communities resilient; and whereas Parks and Rec areas
ensure the ecological beauty of our community and provide a place for children and
adults to connect with nature who recreate outdoors; and whereas the U.S. House of
Representatives has designated July as Parks and Rec Month; so whereas the Town of
Fountain Hills will recognize the benefits derived from parks and recreation resources --
we just heard about the splash park -- so therefore, I, Ginny Dickey, mayor of the Town
of Fountain Hills, do hereby proclaim that July is recognized as Parks and Recreation
Month, this day June 18th, 2024. Yay.
SNIPES: Easily said. Thank you, Mayor. First of all, I'd like to thank all of our staff. They
really take this to heart with everything they do. And if you come to any of our
programs or any of our parks, you can see that on a daily basis. And I'd like to thank
both past and present councils for all your support. Without you guys, we wouldn't be
able to do what we do, and it's my favorite thing to do. So thank you so much.
Appreciate it.
MAYOR DICKEY: Did you get a picture of it? No, I keep forgetting. Thank you, Kevin.
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SNIPES: Thanks.
MAYOR DICKEY: Thank you. Is Susan Dempster here? Okay. I'm going to go do this up
there, then. And we will get give her her certificate of appreciation, and then we'll
move on from up there. Thanks.
It's important, even though Susan isn't here, for me to read what her colleagues and
what we all think of her since she was serving for so long. We would like to recognize
Susan Dempster for her contributions to our community as a member of the Planning
and Zoning Commission. Susan has served on the commission since 2015 as a
commissioner and chairperson. We appreciate Susan's dedicating her time and
expertise to shaping the future of Fountain Hills. She played a vital role in countless
revisions of the zoning ordinance and many cases, from golf nets to the general plan to
some high profile cases: Park Place, Adero Canyon, Daybreak, Fountain Hills Medical
Center, and the Target Center. She always fostered a collaborative environment where
all perspectives were heard and considered. Susan is known for her meticulous research
and preparation for upcoming commission cases. She demonstrated a deep
understanding of the Planning and Zoning principles, which ensured well-balanced
decisions. Susan, wherever you are, we extend our sincerest gratitude for your
commitment to our community. Your presence on the commission has been invaluable,
and we thank you for your service. Let's give her a hand. Thank you.
Now we're going to move on to recognizing our chief financial officer. We're going to
kick it off with our town manager. Thank you.
GOODWIN: Thank you, Mayor. This is hard to do because it doesn't feel real. We've
known that David Pock was going to be relocating. We've known, actually, for a while --
he gave us probably ample notice, probably nine, ten months' notice that it was
coming -- which allowed us to do a lot of strategic planning. It allowed us to bring
somebody else on board to train with him so that they were ready. But it just didn't feel
like the day would actually get here when we would have to really say goodbye. So I do
have a few words to kind of express some of my thoughts. And I'm going to do my best
to get through it without getting too emotional, but.
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Tonight we recognize and celebrate the significant contributions of our outgoing Chief
Financial Officer David Pock, better known in our office as simply Pock. Over the past
five years Pock has been a cornerstone within our organization, guiding us with fiscal
expertise, creative problem solving, and a keen financial acumen that has shaped our
organization. Pock, your strategic vision, and meticulous attention to detail have not
only stabilized our financial health but also positioned us for long-term growth and
prosperity. Under your stewardship, we have navigated through challenges and seized
opportunities, always emerging stronger and more resilient. Your leadership has been
instrumental in shaping the robust and dynamic financial framework our town relies on
today.
Beyond the numbers and balance sheets, you have been a mentor, a collaborator, and a
trusted advisor to us all. Your humility and laughter have helped create a team culture,
and you will be sorely missed by your staff and your colleagues.
On a personal note, I am eternally grateful for your guidance and support that you have
given me as we have navigated leadership changes within the town. Your calm
demeanor and sense of humor during uncertain moments have made all the difference.
Our discussions and analysis might be what I miss most. The subjects have run the
gamut, whether we are having a very deep discussion, comparing the pros and cons of
donut shops, donut styles, or donut toppings -- if you don't know, Dave is a donut kind
of guy - or discussing financial strategies and complex government funding regulations.
Your personal touch has always made me smile. I should issue a word of warning to
your next team of coworkers, though: if he knows your favorite donut, he will make
sure it's in the box, and you will love him for it, but your waistline might not.
As you embark on this new chapter in Tennessee, we want to express our deepest
gratitude for your service and your dedication. Your legacy will continue to guide us,
and we are confident that your future endeavors will be as successful and impactful as
your time with us here in Fountain Hills. We wish you all the best in your future pursuits
and thank you for everything you've done for us.
MAYOR DICKEY: Oh, now you got to him, I think. So before you say anything, I'm going
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to see if anybody up here has anything that they would like to add, after you being such
a good caretaker for us. Councilwoman?
MCMAHON: David, thank you. I remember when I first got elected, I didn't know heck
about the budget. And poor David put up with all my phone calls, my questions, and no
matter what, he had a sense of humor about it and provided invaluable guidance. So
thank you very much from the bottom of my heart. I really hate to see you go, but I
know life's an adventure and you have a great future in front of you. So again, thank
you.
MAYOR DICKEY: Thank you. Councilman?
FRIEDEL: David, thank you for your clarity and direction. The number of calls, the
number of conversations that we had, I really appreciate that from the bottom of my
heart. So you always had the town's best interest at heart. We appreciate that and we
respect that. And good luck in your future endeavors.
MAYOR DICKEY: Councilwoman?
GRZYBOWSKI: Thank you for explaining the same thing to me over and over and over
again, because I don't like the mathing [sic] stuff. So you did a great job of explaining it
in simple terms, and I really appreciate that. I know the citizens appreciate how
responsive you've been. I just -- like, I told you, I'm really going to miss you. I think
you've been a great asset to the town, and I can't say anything more than I appreciate
you. And if you need a letter of recommendation, let me know.
MAYOR DICKEY: Councilwoman?
TOTH: David, you have been so helpful in getting our budget in perfect order, and you
are a wealth of knowledge on this topic that's very complicated. You've been very
patient with my probably kind of dumb questions sometimes, and I will think back to
one of the very first meetings where you explained the buckets, and I will never forget
that entire explanation; it was so helpful. I just -- we're going to miss you a lot. And
thank you so much for all you've done for this town.
MAYOR DICKEY: Vice Mayor?
VICE CHAIR KALIVIANAKIS: Yeah. Thank you, Ms. Mayor.
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Yeah, David, I just want to reemphasize what everyone has said up here. Thank you for
making the complex simple and understandable. The budget is such a difficult thing.
And every time anybody reached out, it seems like you just gave good answers. And
thank you for your steady guidance and your leadership and Godspeed in your future
endeavors.
MAYOR DICKEY: Yes. Thank you, David. Before you have to come up, I just want to say
thank you for everything that you've done. I meant it; you've been a great caretaker.
You've taken us through all kinds of issues and legislative turbulence. And you've given
me my favorite phrase, which is conservative budgeting with continuously higher
revenues and lower expenditures than expected. So we've done that every single year.
And as everyone said, you always responded thoroughly and clearly, and we really
appreciate that. And we have the awards to show it. And thank you for staying on,
because Paul has shown such an amazing way to step in, and we are going to look
forward to working with him. And we're going to look forward to hearing good things
about you.
And we'd like you to come on up and -- oh, by the way, we have a nice photo over there
and a card, and you don't have to do anything with them right now, but just come on
up. And thank you for everything.
POCK: I've got notes. I didn't trust my emotions and I'm glad I took them. It was a
very -- thank you. Thank you, Mayor and Council. It's it's been a pleasure serving the
town and its residents for the past five years. But I wouldn't have made it this long
without the help and support of an incredible finance team, who are in the back -- love
you -- the town manager and every other town employee that comes to work every day
trying to make the town a better place to live and work than it was the day before. It's
been my honor and pleasure to work with such dedicated individuals. Damn.
I'm confident that the town has a bright future ahead. However, the amount of time
and effort it takes to get there will depend on everyone's ability to listen to opposing
opinions and reach meaningful compromises that will benefit everyone and not just a
few. I wish all of you -- I should have used y'all there. I got to start practicing. I wish
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y'all the best. See you on YouTube. And please speak into the microphone, because my
hearing isn't as good as it used to be.
Thank you all very much. I really appreciate it.
MAYOR DICKEY: Do you want a picture? Do you want to come up here, maybe, and we
can squeeze?
POCK: Sure.
MAYOR DICKEY: Thank you, all. We have no presentations for tonight, so our next item
is call to the public. Speaker cards, please?
MENDENHALL: Yes, Mayor, we do. In your packet is one comment card for your review.
And then we do have -- looks like six cards in person to speak. We will start the evening
off with Liz Gildersleeve, and on deck, Rick Watts.
GILDERSLEEVE: Good evening all. Liz Gildersleeve, Fountain Hills resident. At the last
town council meeting, a Fountain Hills resident stated, during her Call to Public -- and
I'm paraphrasing -- that everything was essentially fine with this council, with the
exception of one councilman behaving inappropriately.
I'd like to offer a different perspective tonight. For starters, we have Councilwoman
McMahon driving around town taking photos of political signs in peoples' front yards.
How do I know this? I have a security photo of her sitting outside my front yard, taking
a picture of my signs and my house. I got to believe there are more pressing town
issues that you could -- that you could be focused on besides policing people's front
yards.
Next, we have the roadblocks that this council has erected regarding a broadband
ordinance. Specifically, Mayor Dickey and Councilmembers McMahon, Grzybowski, and
Kalivianakis voted against sharing a broadband ordinance draft with the Planning and
Zoning Commission during the last town council meeting that we, the taxpayers, already
paid an expert approximately eight grand to create. The council denied P&Z's request
by hiding behind executive session discussion privileges. This continues the lack of
transparency and abuse of the executive session privilege by Mayor Dickey. And to
boot, Councilmember Kalivianakis took it further at the last council meeting and
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disparaged the volunteer members of the P&Z Commission and weirdly labeled them,
quote, "farmers and butchers", end quote.
Third, Councilmember Kalivianakis continues to use private email for town
communications. On Friday, May 31st, I shared an email thread with the town manager
and the entire council involving Kalivianakis and a resident via her private email, where
she signed the private email as Brenda Kalivianakis, Vice Mayor, along with all the other
identifying information you'd expect to see in a public email, and once again suggesting
Kalivianakis continues to use private email for town purposes. I asked Mayor Dickey if
this was appropriate behavior, and I never got a response.
And finally, we learned recently that Councilwoman McMahon received a $1,500
campaign donation from Republic Services PAC, while Mayor Dickey received a 5,000
campaign donation from Republic Services, despite having oversight of Republic
Services' exclusive contract with Fountain Hills. Is this paying for influence? Is this a
conflict of interest? Sure looks like it could be.
So there's plenty of bad behavior to go around, and it isn't centered on one councilman.
Thank you for your attention tonight.
WATTS: Mayor, Council, Rick Watts, resident and proud member of the Planning and
Zoning Commission. I'm here before you this evening to express my extreme frustration
with the comments and arrogance of certain councilmen during the town council
meeting of June 4th. It was inexcusable to refer to the commissioners of the Planning
and Zoning Commission as farmers and butchers. It was insulting to flippantly hear that
the council does not have to listen to, or even consider, the recommendation of the
Planning and Zoning Commission. It was impertinent to read a rationalization rather
than a simple apology. By the way, I suggest that you look at the qualifications on the
website for a Planning and Zoning commissioner. I don't find any farmers or butchers
listed as a qualifier.
I ask, why do the members of the Planning and Zoning Commission waste their time
researching, exploring options, debating, discussing, doing the heavy lifting on behalf of
the residents to be insulted and so casually dismissed? Planning and Zoning
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commissioners have spent hundreds of hours studying the 5G broadband issue and have
been misdirected, redirected, stalled, and stonewalled, obtaining any and all
information that is necessary to draft a comprehensive ordinance that addresses the
safety, health, and well-being of our town residents. I can accept the council's
directions, but not the insults.
The town administrative organizational chart clearly shows that the council is
subordinate to the town residents, and yet the council continues to conceal information
that is clearly in the public's best interest to know, consider, and understand. Who ever
heard of a subordinate refusing to provide the supervisor with her work documents?
With all due respect to Director Wesley and our town staff, they are not experts in the
field of radio frequency transmission and any potential side effects. The topics are --
technically and legally surpass their level of expertise. I challenge anyone on the council
to debate the topic of 5G based on the information you've been provided by town staff.
How can the councilman whimsically and arrogantly brush off Planning and Zoning's
requests and recommendations? Debate, discussion, and considering all information is
the essence of creating a solid, balanced ordinance that is focused on and protects the
town welfare. Considering the advice of experts is a hallmark of good leaders that
acknowledge limitations and put aside individual egos.
This council has approved expenditures literally tens of thousands of dollars studying
traffic signs, traffic signals, crosswalks, parking, roundabouts, just to name a few, but
refuses to engage an unbiased expert that's versed in the legal and technical issues that
have could have a dramatic, short- and long-term effect on town residents, both
property valuations and potential health perspectives.
Being a thought leader is about doing the best you can do to protect the town residents
with a full understanding of legal and technical aspects challenging the status quo.
Comments like "farmers and butchers" make me question if the Planning and Zoning
Commission should just defer any difficult or challenging issues directly to the self-
proclaimed superior intelligence of the town council, to allow the council the
opportunity to do the hard work and heavy lifting, researching the details that were so
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quickly and easily dismissed without merit. Thank you.
MENDENHALL: Next we have Barry Wolborsky, and on deck, Kim Bartmann.
MR. WOLBORSKY: Barry Wolborsky, Fountain Hills, resident. At the last council
meeting, there was a somewhat heated discussion about what to call the organization
ROT. It was initially called ROT, then corrected to Reclaim Our Town. I, however, like
the name ROT. I moved to Seattle from Los Angeles in 1972. I was amazed how clean it
was and how safe it was to walk anywhere, day or night. Now I have a friend that owns
a business in Seattle. Seattle allows the homeless to live in junk cars anywhere there is
a legal parking place, even residential streets. He has to go out every morning and clean
human feces off the sidewalk so his clients don't have to walk in it. Seattle has a budget
for stores to paint murals on the plywood where their windows used to be.
The first time I went to Portland, only about 160 miles from Seattle, I fell in love with it.
A beautiful city built at the intersection of two majestic rivers. Now some areas of the
city have crime rates 250 percent higher than national average, and the police force is
ranked 48th among the country's 50th largest cities in police per capita, because the
police won't go to work there.
San Francisco is a wonderful place with its fine dining, waterfront, and cultural
attractions. The city just passed a law that businesses can't have large planters in front
of their business because it prevents the homeless from camping there. Yes, ROT is a
great name for what has happened to Seattle, Portland, San Francisco, and many other
liberal-leaning cities in this country. And never say those famous last words, it could
never happen here.
BARTMANN: Kim Bartmann, Fountain Hills resident. I'm here to speak to our
community and those in attendance, those watching on Channel 11 and watching on
YouTube. Last week I attended the mayoral candidate forum, and the week prior to, the
town council candidate forum. Did you attend or watch online? Do you need more
information? Who will you vote for to best represent our town for mayor and council?
Will they vote for what is best for our town or for their party? Do they uplift our town
or use scare tactics? Are they supported by or support the PAC, Ruin our Town, ROT,
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who litters our major streets with negative signs? Are they divisive, or can you see them
bring everyone together for the common good of our town?
Trust your friends and neighbors, or ask your friends and neighbors who they are voting
for. Then check out the candidate's social media. Check out their website. Find out
what type of volunteerism they have done in the community. Read their letters to the
editor. Watch the candidate forums. Didn't attend the candidate forums? Ask those
who attended and who took notes. Reach out to the candidates, ask about where they
stand on issues that are important to you. If you admire or appreciate current
candidates, ask them who they recommend. Then do your own homework. Don't sit
out this election. Be sure who you vote for cares about Fountain Hills and are not trying
to garner attention for higher office or seeking the spotlight. This will waste time and
money and take away from the issues that are important to continue to help Fountain
Hills thrive. Vote responsibly. Vote for those who truly care about our town and
residents. Thank you.
MENDENHALL: Next we have Matthew Corrigan. On deck, Lori Troller.
CORRIGAN: Madam Mayor, Councilmembers. I hadn't planned to speak tonight, but I'm
doing so because I'm reminded of something that happened yesterday -- not this year,
but in 1775. Sunday, I began to fly the Bunker Hill flag with a Gadsden flag, and I've
been doing so for about a month, tracking the historical content of the flag, which we
honored in Flag Day recently. Why the battle of Bunker Hill? Constant usurpations from
the King, King George, a tyrant. We all know this.
This happened because people who consider themselves Britons -- Englishmen -- were
treated as foreigners. They were not allowed to speak freely. They were not allowed to
meet. The government required that they quarter soldiers in their homes. Many
usurpations, many damages, not only to First Amendment rights, which we now have
and didn't have then, but Second Amendment rights and so on. The list goes on.
What does this have to do with my speaking tonight? Well, the Battle of Bunker Hill was
a British -- supposed to be a British pouncing of the patriots. But what happened was
2,000 Brits died that day and only 420 patriots. And they stood proudly. They were just
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standing there with muskets at the top of the hill, fighting the most powerful army in
the world. One of those founding fathers, one of those patriots was Thomas Paine. And
why is that significant? Because he is known to have said, I will defend to the death
your right to say it.
Let me begin at the beginning. I may not agree with what you say, but I will defend to
the death your right to say it. That's the importance of public comments. What I see
recently is troubling. Residents who get up here and speak, hopefully, instructively, and
knowledgeably, are then sometimes castigated personally. The bully pulpit has been a
term which has been used. The bully pulpit is effective. Why? Because in essence, that
speaker, that resident has no power to respond. Is it unfair? Yes. Should we think
about it? Yes. Please think about that during the summer and have a great summer.
Thank you.
TROLLER: Lori Troller, resident. Resolution 2018-18 is the Fountain Hills law that
pertains to the building infrastructure of cellular and broadband services. That is what
Mr. Wesley and P&Z should be working on. Updating that is what would accomplish
what you, the council, thought you were asking them to do. Mr. Wesley is not working
on that. He's working on the municipal code. Where did that directive come from?
Who picked the municipal code over the resolution? Did that start with Aaron?
Mr. Wesley says his direction comes from Rachael, but the council says it comes from
them. So who is it? Who is -- is really important that we know this, and there is a
correct answer to it.
The public has every right to know exactly what and where that direction came from.
But we don't, because this and the majority of two years of work have been kept out of
the purview of the public, which, frankly, favors the telecom industry. All this, despite
the fact that the town council is supposed to conduct itself in the spirit of open
transparency to the public. An example of abuse of executive session.
The council does not write the agenda for the executive session. That fault isn't theirs.
Let's add to the fact that the town is now illegally denying FOIA requests on aspects of
this topic. This particular law is extremely sophisticated, highly technical, and legally
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savvy at an industrial level. It's beyond Mr. Wesley's experience. His cut-and-paste style
is not yielding the strongest possible law.
This isn't a personal jab at anyone on the dais or the staff; it's just the simple fact that
no one has experience with this stuff. You could, if you conducted public workshops
with safe tech experts, heck, you don't even understand how to measure emissions.
How are you going to maintain FCC emission limits when you put these things next to
people's houses? Mr. Wesley's writing doesn't include this.
P&Z realized they don't understand this, and they want to understand more. They've
been begging for four months for your help. They were provided no information and
denied access to professional help. The majority of the council refuses it. There is a
single -- or there isn't a single smell test that council majority passes when you alienate
P&Z and the public like this. The town has set the tone two years ago, when the town
lawyer actually told us we weren't allowed to update our law. He said providers need to
install towers in our front yards, and this is grossly incorrect and bad advice.
The mayor stated there's nothing that you can do. So basically, so what? You get a
tower in your yard. It meets FCC safety standards. Again, this is grossly incorrect and
not reflective of the majority of constituents.
And yes, Mayor, obviously you haven't read the law; 40-foot towers can go in residents'
yards. And at the last meeting, I was completely floored when you didn't realize this,
which means over the last two years, you haven't even cared enough to read the law
that we're trying to update. In the last two years, except for the last meeting, there's
only been three agenda items on this. I hope sometime in the future working on this
issue doesn't run into these roadblocks we have. Thank you.
MENDENHALL: Our last comment card is, and last speaker is Ed Stizza.
STIZZA: Good evening, Mayor, Town Council, staff, and our new lawyer. No. So I've got
quite a bit to say. I requested six minutes at the last meeting and was denied, and love
to request that again, but I'll focus on one subject again. And that is the way the town
conducts and does business.
Over the past three and a half years that I've been back, I've seen complete evidence of
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doing business badly, period, on several different issues. And what's been happening,
all you have to do is walk outside our door or the door of the town hall, and you don't
have to go very far to see the actual end result of the leadership and decisions that have
been made in these four walls. It's appalling. It's insulting. And it's absolutely
disrespectful to the residents of Fountain Hills. We need a change in leadership. I'm
sorry, and I don't really want to get up here and be critical, but we only have so much
time, and the critical things are overtaking what we actually have here, our beautiful
city. And you have got to stop. I mean, it's just absolutely appalling what has been
happening in these four walls.
We have a fence that is in a main area of our downtown that has been up for two years.
What have you done about it? Nothing. Absolutely nothing.
You allowed, Mayor Dickey, the destruction of Adero Canyon, and that was one of the
most pristine, beautiful areas in Fountain Hills, and you allowed it to be destroyed. So
all you have to look -- all you have to do is look around, see the esthetic that's here in
town. We have a hodgepodge town that should be one of the best in the country. And
all these decisions have done nothing but made a major mess of this hodgepodge. It's
got to stop. We need a change. We need a change in how this is all done or how all of
you conduct business. We need a change in how our staff conducts business. We need
a change in how our lawyer conducts business.
And the fact that you actually demeaned Planning and Zoning was, again, it was
absolutely disgusting. You should be respecting them. They have collectively way more
experience on all the issues that I'm talking about right now than any of you do, and
maybe collectively. So the opinions that you all present have got to end. I mean, you
are managing this town, Mayor Dickey, with only a handful of people, and it is not in any
way, shape, or form allowing the voices to take somewhat of an -- how can I say --
where everybody can hear the voices of the actual public. You've stopped that and
you've done a really good job of doing that. And I mean, evidence of you worked very
hard at the actual -- at the referendum and stopping it. And you did. Should have let
that voice be heard. Thank you.
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MAYOR DICKEY: I'm not going to --
VICE CHAIR KALIVIANAKIS: If it's all right, I think I'm going to address it.
MAYOR DICKEY: All right. Go ahead.
VICE CHAIR KALIVIANAKIS: Okay. Thank you, Ms. Mayor. Yeah, I'd just like to make a
couple comments tonight about this farmers and butchers remark. Anybody that's had
a social study class knows that from the president of the United States to our
congressmen, senators, to our boards, commissions, and our town councils are
comprised of average citizens. That's the point I made. That's the point I will stand by.
There is no elite aristocracy in this country that are appointed by politburos from
Washington to populate boards and commissions. We're all -- I am that farmer. I am
that butcher. That's me. Prior to running for this office, I was playing the saxophone
and bowling three times a week, and they asked me, Brenda, would you run for office?
And I said, sure, because they said we needed talent like yours.
I don't consider myself an expert on anything. As a matter of fact, if there's one thing
I've said to our town manager and our mayor is we don't know anything. Our town staff
knows. That's why we pay them the money. That's why we pay that lawyer the money.
That's why we pay our public works director that money. So I don't understand where
this comes from, that it's an insult to be a regular person in office.
Now, I did hear that they took my words, and they were offended. And so after that
meeting, I wrote the Planning and Zoning Commission at the June 4th town council
meeting. I referenced the fact that the P&Z members are not telecommunications
experts, but rather, people like farmers and butchers and people of the town, just like
all of us who volunteer to contribute their varied expertise to issues confronting the
P&Z. Rather than pulling random examples of occupations out of the air, I could have
said our councils, boards, and commissions are populated by average citizens from all
walks of life who wanted to answer the call to public service.
Councilman Friedel told me the night afterwards that he was concerned that my
remarks might have been perceived as pejorative towards the Planning and Zoning
commissioners. This is a letter I wrote to them: I can assure you that that was not my
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intent, and perhaps my statement was clumsy, and maybe I should have said it
differently. If that's the case, and if anybody felt slighted by being compared to farmers
and butchers, both noble professions, I sincerely apologize. We're all doing the best we
can, and I'm always grateful for the thoughtful and deliberative contributions of the
Planning and Zoning Commission, whatever their backgrounds may bring to the mix.
I penned that and I sent it to the Planning and Zoning Commission, because the last
thing I want to do is insult people. And so what I'm trying to say to you tonight is, this is
a tempest in a teapot. This is a political hit job by people that don't like me. That's
okay. But I will stand by those statements. We are all average citizens. We are all doing
the best that we can and we all are bringing our best efforts to serve this town.
MAYOR DICKEY: Thank you. Our next item is our consent agenda. Unless anybody
would like something removed, could I get a motion, please?
GRZYBOWSKI: Move to approve.
MCMAHON: Second.
MAYOR DICKEY: A roll call?
MENDENHALL: Councilmember Toth?
TOTH: Aye.
MENDENHALL: Councilmember Friedel?
FRIEDEL: Aye.
MENDENHALL: Councilmember Skillicorn?
SKILLICORN: Yes.
MENDENHALL: Councilmember Grzybowski?
GRZYBOWSKI: Aye.
MENDENHALL: Councilmember McMahon?
MCMAHON: Aye.
MENDENHALL: Vice Mayor Kalivianakis?
VICE CHAIR KALIVIANAKIS: Aye.
MENDENHALL: Mayor Dickey?
MAYOR DICKEY: Aye. Thank you.
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Our first item is approval of recommendation of appointment to the Planning and
Zoning Commission. As always, we have a subcommittee that makes recommendations
to the mayor, and they have recommended that we appoint Phil Sveum for a partial
term. So it will go through April 30th, 2025. Could I get a motion, please?
MCMAHON: Move to approve.
FRIEDEL: Second.
MAYOR DICKEY: Thank you. Roll call?
MENDENHALL: Councilmember Friedel?
FRIEDEL: Aye.
MENDENHALL: Councilmember Skillicorn?
SKILLICORN: Yes.
MENDENHALL: Councilmember Grzybowski?
GRZYBOWSKI: Aye.
MENDENHALL: Councilmember McMahon?
MCMAHON: Aye.
MENDENHALL: Councilmember Toth?
TOTH: Aye.
MENDENHALL: Vice Mayor Kalivianakis?
VICE CHAIR KALIVIANAKIS: Aye.
MENDENHALL: Mayor Dickey?
MAYOR DICKEY: Aye. Thank you. Thanks for everybody who applied, and we look
forward to working with Phil. And thank you to the committee for making the
recommendation.
Our next item is a public hearing. I will open it up. We'll hear from staff about allowing
patio covers. Then we'll take cards and we'll close the hearing, and council can discuss.
Thank you.
WESLEY: Good evening, Mayor and Council. I'll have a brief presentation for you this
evening to review this proposed text amendment. As you're aware, the zoning
ordinance established various setbacks, lot coverage requirements for different
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structures in different zoning districts. Most districts do require some type of setback
from property lines for structures to help maintain an open field and appearance along
streets and provide the densities and lot coverages that we look for.
This request is to create an exception to some of those setback requirements to allow
patio covers to encroach into front and street side yards.
Before we could actually get to those standards, as we looked at the ordinance, we
recognized we didn't have any specific definition of what we mean when we say patio or
patio cover. So part of this text amendment is to add those definitions, which are
shown here on the screen. And then from there we looked at the regulations. Section
5.06D of the Zoning Ordinance provides some current exceptions to the setback
requirements. And so the proposal is to amend that Section D by adding a new 4 to
provide for these patio covers.
And so this introductory language of this new section says that this type of
encroachment will be allowed with the following standards, the first of which is that in
order to obtain approval, they would first need to apply for a special use permit as
provided for in Section 2.02 of the Zoning Ordinance, with a couple of minor exceptions;
rather than the 300-foot boundary notification that goes with the standard SUP, it
would just be the abutting neighbors along the street. And instead of the full fee, which
is, as I recall, a $2,000 application fee, it would just be ten percent of whatever the fee
is. So it's more reasonable for this minor type of change.
Then beyond that, the ordinance then provides some standards with regard to the
exceptions that would be allowed. So it starts with a patio cover, May extend into one-
half of the required setback up to 15 feet. Most of our setback in the residential
districts are 20 feet, but in some of the larger lots, they do get to be a little bit more
than that. So that's where the 15 feet would come in.
Just as a graphic example of what that might look like. The orange areas, including the
area under the green, are the standard setbacks. And then, so the green shows that half
the setback encroachment that could occur with these patios and patio covers.
The next provision is that the patio cover may not exceed more than 90 percent of the
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height of the adjacent wall, or up to a maximum of 12 feet. So using a previous example
that had been submitted for a similar type patio cover, you can see what we're talking
about in terms of the patio cover and its extension from and in front of a structure.
As staff continued to look at this and had some discussion with the language as it was
proposed by the P&Z -- well, let me back up just a moment.
That provision on the height, the 90 percent came through discussion at the P&Z
Commission. And as we had time to consider that just a little bit more, we saw maybe
some challenges with that particular wording. You look at the elevation behind this
particular house, and there's various levels to that facade. So where are you measuring
the 90 percent at? Then also you can have different designs of a home where that may
or may not make sense.
And so as an alternative to that, the council may want to consider the language as
proposed here, the maximum would be -- because it's coming through a special use
permit to council, so we could leave it open. So as the council approves the height,
that's what it could be. And still include some maximum, such as the 12 feet or maybe a
fifteen-foot maximum height, but leave the flexibility for the design of the individual
house and structure and what it's in front of rather than putting that strict 90 percent,
that may be a challenge in some cases to understand what it means if it really works
with the house.
So there's that potential change from what was in the ordinance going on to the next
part of 4.b in terms of the basic standards for the patio cover, the structure -- excuse
me -- the structures that hold up the patio cover -- because we're trying to -- they're
encroaching into that setback; we don't want a solid wall there. That's why we have
setbacks to begin with. But you're going to need some structure to hold up the roof. So
how much structure can that be? And so we're proposing that along any side that's in
the setback area, that can exceed more than 20 percent of the width of that side. And
so here are some examples of what these things might look like in terms of its posts
with a roof. As long as those combined area of the post doesn't exceed more than 20
percent of a side, then that works, but leaves a lot of design flexibility with individual
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house and its architecture to design that structure.
And then the last piece of the ordinance and 4.c, just some minor restrictions. Patio
may not ultimately be enclosed. Again, it's into a setback area, so we maintain that
openness and may not be used as a carport, garage, or other types of storage. It needs
to remain used as a patio.
So Planning and Zoning Commission held a public hearing at the May 13th meeting. Had
one citizen provide some comments. Staff and Planning Commission are recommending
approval.
MAYOR DICKEY: Thank you very much. Do we have any speaker cards?
MENDENHALL: No, Mayor, we do not.
MAYOR DICKEY: Okay. Then I'm going to close the hearing, and we can ask you
questions and speak amongst ourselves. Just one thing, quick. The only thing different
than in what's written on here is the 12-foot max. So if we wanted to make a motion for
24-10, we would say with that change?
WESLEY: Correct?
MAYOR DICKEY: Okay. Okay. Councilwoman?
MCMAHON: John, thank you. I have a couple concerns with this and I'm just going to
go through a couple of them, if you don't mind. I want to know about affecting the
visibility. You say they're going to give notice to the neighbors. What's the effect of that
if they don't want it? And are these going to be solid? What can these be made of?
Canvas? You know, is it going to have to come -- fit within the neighborhood, so to
speak, architecturally, et cetera? Because I can see where everybody has different
tastes. It might not fit with someone's, like, particular patio, the other cover, the other
person may not, et cetera. So I'm concerned about lack of direction in this. Or is that an
SUP? And also -- that's enough for now, but I still have another question or two. Thank
you.
WESLEY: Yes, Mayor, Councilmember McMahon. The SUP process, it would be like any
other special use permit. It would go with the public notice, through P&Z, and to council
at hearings. And so the citizens would have that opportunity to express their concerns
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at those levels. And council could ultimately deny it, or similar to looking at the height,
that architectural compatibility certainly could be part of that review.
MCMAHON: Okay. So it's not just going to be anything and anything anywhere, et
cetera? It's going to -- and these are not HOA neighborhoods because HOAs usually
govern that, correct?
WESLEY: So Mayor, Councilmember, HOAs may have their own rules --
MCMAHON: Right.
WESLEY: -- that they would have to follow.
MCMAHON: Okay.
WESLEY: So those are separate than the town's.
MCMAHON: Okay. All right. Thank you so much. I appreciate it.
MAYOR DICKEY: Vice Mayor?
VICE MAYOR KALIVIANAKIS: Thank you, Ms. Mayor. Thank you for your presentation,
John. Just a couple things. On the definition, it talks about the patio. The definition is,
can be open or closed. But then if you go down to 4.c, it says they may not be enclosed.
So this would be, they can be enclosed if it's on the back of the house or the side of the
house, but if it's in front of the house, we don't want those enclosed?
WESLEY: Mayor, Vice Mayor, if it encroaches into the setback, we don't want it
enclosed. But as long as it's within the setback area, just like any house --
VICE MAYOR KALIVIANAKIS: Okay.
WESLEY: -- it could be enclosed.
VICE MAYOR KALIVIANAKIS: Okay. Good. Thank you for clarifying that. And then my
other concern is b.2 about "May not exceed the height of more than 90 percent of the
adjacent building". And so again, just so I can get a visual here, if you've got a roof line
that comes down, would the shade structure have to be below to -- at least ten percent
below the roof line?
WESLEY: Mayor, Vice Mayor, the way it's worded -- excuse me -- here is the adjacent
wall. So whatever that wall height is. So if you do have a sloped roof, then it would be
the roof where it hits that wall.
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VICE MAYOR KALIVIANAKIS: What about the roof line as compared to the shade
structure? Could that be at the roof line level and extend out?
WESLEY: Vice Mayor, since the roof itself is going to be above the wall to some --
VICE MAYOR KALIVIANAKIS: Okay.
WESLEY: -- minor bit, or it's going to be sitting on top of, so it's the wall itself that we
would measure the height of.
VICE MAYOR KALIVIANAKIS: Okay.
WESLEY: So it's 90 percent of that wall --
VICE MAYOR KALIVIANAKIS: Okay.
WESLEY: -- as currently drafted.
VICE MAYOR KALIVIANAKIS: Okay. Thank you.
MAYOR DICKEY: Any other discussion or motion. Councilwoman?
TOTH: I'd like to make a motion to approve with the proposed alternate language that
John suggested; that the height may be as approved by the town council but may not
exceed 12 feet in height.
SKILLICORN: Second.
MAYOR DICKEY: Thank you. Could we get a roll call, please?
MENDENHALL: Councilmember Skillicorn?
SKILLICORN: Yes.
MENDENHALL: Councilmember Grzybowski?
GRZYBOWSKI: Aye.
MENDENHALL: Councilmember McMahon?
MCMAHON: Aye.
MENDENHALL: Councilmember Toth?
TOTH: Aye.
MENDENHALL: Councilmember Friedel?
FRIEDEL: Aye.
MENDENHALL: Vice Mayor Kalivianakis?
VICE MAYOR KALIVIANAKIS: Aye.
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MENDENHALL: Mayor Dickey?
MAYOR DICKEY: Aye. Thank you very much.
Our next item is a waiver of fill standards. And that's going to be you again, John. Thank
you.
WESLEY: So Mayor, we're looking at property on 9130 North Hummingbird Trail with
this request. So Zoning Ordinance Section 5.03 establishes limits for the amount of cut
and fill that can take place during a development project, and it sets that at ten feet.
However, it does provide for developer to apply for a waiver from the council to have
more or less than that ten-foot cut or fill. The basic goal is we're trying to maintain the
topography in the town, utilize that, and also avoid big blank stem walls.
So the home is being prepared as designed for the property on Hummingbird Trail. It's
been in review. And as part of that review, we recognize that they have some area with
excessive fill based on the code. It's a very steep lot with a ten-foot drop in elevation
from west to east. They're proposing basically a single-story home on the house on the
property. And as we've reviewed it, there's an area of about 534 square feet on the east
side that has fill more than ten feet at the max. It's about 14 feet. So the lot is shown
here in the red area in the star at the end of Hummingbird Trail. And here you can see
that topography. The blue lines are ten feet on here. So you can see how much that
falls from the west to the east down to that low area along the east side. The area
that's shaded in is the area where the fill exceeds the ten-foot maximum height. And
this shows adjacent properties and what their view of the portion of the house would be
where that extensive fill occurs. So they're relatively far away, and particularly the one
that's 450 feet away, that's really quite a ways up a hill also.
So this may be a little bit hard to read, but you can see on here the grade of the
property. And then this dashed line represents the finished floor area for the home.
And so they've got some retaining walls in front of, then the stem wall of the house.
And so you can see back here at the highest point that stem wall is 14 feet worth of fill
to bring that up to that finished floor level. And that's the portion, then, that is
somewhat visible from the neighbors. Again, they're far away. But that's the part that
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the staff is concerned about of the ordinance is trying to help address.
The landscape plan has been provided by the applicant for the property. The areas
circled in the red are the plants that are immediately in front of this property.
Landscape architecture and plants are not my strongest suit, but I have looked at these,
and they're generally lower growing plants, as I have reviewed them. And also the area
up here, shaded in, is the area that's just above those retaining walls. And I'm not
seeing any landscape material in that particular area. And so as I've looked at this, it
appears that we could probably do a little bit more through the landscape plan to help
mitigate the view of that stem wall by having some more plant materials in this location.
But given the small amount of excess fill, the distance it is from other structures, and I
think, the ability to screen some of that through some landscaping in that corner, staff is
supportive of the fill waiver.
MAYOR DICKEY: Thank you very much. Do we have any speaker cards?
MENDENHALL: Yes, Mayor, we do. Lisa Rogers.
ROGERS: Hello. Hello, Council. I'm the architect. And everything that we wanted to do
is to keep the house at one level. And because of the grade and all that, we're
proposing that the fill is going to be excessive, but it's only about 530 square feet, plus
there's -- what do you call it? Oh, that there's a ordinance that would fill the excess fill
under the house would be five percent of the home. So that would be -- therefore,
there would be 207 square feet of the -- square foot underneath the house that would
have to be waived. So I'm hoping that that you guys will waive this. That's it.
MAYOR DICKEY: Thank you. Any questions for our guest or for John? Any further -- oh,
I'm sorry. Oh. Go ahead. I'm sorry.
GRZYBOWSKI: I just wanted to say, as somebody that wants a one-story house
themselves, I wholeheartedly support this. We need to do what we can with our limited
lots that are available. They're all at a pretty steep grade, or many of them are at a
pretty steep grade. So I think it's really important that we be open-minded to this kind
of thing, because a whole lot of us don't want to have two stories worth a house to have
to clean. So I'm actually ready to make an approval to -- motion to approve this as
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written.
VICE MAYOR KALIVIANAKIS: Second.
MAYOR DICKEY: Councilman, did you --
SKILLICORN: Madam Mayor. And actually, I know this lot. And there's actually -- at the
bottom of the hill, there's a wash there. So this is a unique solution. I'm actually quite
excited. Something is going to go into it because it's a very beautiful area. And this is a
beautiful lot. I'm glad there's going to be something that fits that role. And the fact that
we didn't hear any neighbors to complain about it was a good thing also. I mean, that's
what we ought to look for, but it's great that we found a use for this. And I think it's
going to add to the -- as also another new home on this Hummingbird also. So sounds
great.
MAYOR DICKEY: MAYOR DICKEY: Councilwoman?
TOTH: I'm also supportive of this. I mean, we are called Fountain Hills for a reason. But
just for the peace of mind of everybody watching at home. John, could you clarify? It
looks like a very small area that would be, maybe, kind of, sort of, part of the wash, just
so that it's on record. Is this affecting drainage at all?
WESLEY: Mayor, Councilmember, no. All that's taken into account through the building
plan review.
TOTH: Perfect. Thank you.
MAYOR DICKEY: Very good. Roll call, please?
MENDENHALL: Councilmember Grzybowski?
GRZYBOWSKI: Aye.
MENDENHALL: Councilmember McMahon?
MCMAHON: Aye.
MENDENHALL: Councilmember Toth?
TOTH: Aye.
MENDENHALL: Councilmember Friedel?
FRIEDEL: Aye.
MENDENHALL: Councilmember Skillicorn?
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SKILLICORN: Yes.
MENDENHALL: Vice Mayor Kalivianakis?
VICE MAYOR KALIVIANAKIS: Aye.
MENDENHALL: Mayor Dickey?
MAYOR DICKEY: Aye. Thank you very much.
Our next item is Justin is going to talk to us about our job order, master agreement:
contracts.
WELDY: Madam Mayor, Councilmembers. There's been a lot of discussion with
department heads in the town manager about job order contracts. They're a simplified
method of addressing the needs of a smaller community like this. The town manager
and I had a discussion just a few days ago, and I let her know that I was going to take a
look over the past several years for seven job order contracts that we had utilized for
various tasks. Having done that, I will tell you that the largest number, which is around
$600,000 for one of them, was utilized to clean up Golden Eagle Park after some storm
events. There are several of the job order contracts that had zero for their
approximately seven years' of use.
The other big hitter in the JOCs were tied to capital projects, the community center, and
playgrounds. But the lion's share of all of those job order contracts that were approved
by some of these councilmembers or previous councilmembers averaged 1,000 here,
2,000 there, 5,000, 6,000. A couple of them were closer to 8,000. But all of them in
those lower dollar figures were for plumbing and electrical repairs to the facilities that
the town owns.
It becomes a little bit challenging for someone like myself or the town manager or any
other department head to step up here and ask the mayor and council to consider
approving a series of contracts with a $250,000 per calendar year for the uses that I just
described. It becomes less challenging when we think about what we're here for as a
whole. The town manager and all the department directors and all the divisions under
there, we are stewards of the people's money. I'm not aware of a single individual at
the department or management level that is using any of this money for a want. All of
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these contracts, when utilized, are absolutely for needs. And those needs are the
facilities and infrastructure that belong to the people.
It should be noted that as part of this approval, no money will be encumbered for any
one of these agreements. When staff has a task, be it a capital project or basic
maintenance, or a need in the middle of the night to repair a sewer line, depending on
the dollar threshold, we may or may not get the town manager out of bed, or we will
wait until the next morning and move on it to take care of that issue. If they become
larger than $250,000, we'll obviously have a discussion. But like I said, these are all for
general services, and over the last several years, the two largest ones were for storm
cleanup and capital projects. All the rest of them were either not utilized for whatever
reason, and the remainder of them were plumbing and electrical repairs.
With that, I'll certainly do my best to answer any questions that you may have related to
this.
MAYOR DICKEY: Thank you. Do we have any speaker cards?
MENDENHALL: No, Mayor, we do not.
MAYOR DICKEY: Thank you. Questions for Justin. Councilmember Toth?
TOTH: I just want to say, Justin, speaking my language over here with the, These are the
the assets of the people. We are stewards of the people's money. And Justin does a
wonderful job of prioritizing these projects. I think every time you come up here, you
have a wealth of knowledge. You're prepared for any question. I just really appreciate
you. But with this project, I am ready to make a motion to approve.
MAYOR DICKEY: Thank you. Vice Mayor?
VICE MAYOR KALIVIANAKIS: Thank you, Ms. Mayor. I just had a few questions for you,
Justin, if you don't mind. It says, again, we're going to be approving, each agreement
will be for the amount not to exceed $250,000 per year. Just for clarification, if you look
at each of the individual contracts from the subcontractors -- and this might be a
question either for the finance guy or the town manager -- but under compensation,
under each of the contracts, it says the town shall not pay the vendor an aggregate
amount not to exceed $250,000, with the amount not to exceed $125,000 annually -- a
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12-month period. And I'm just trying to get a figure on, are we approving 125,000
annually, as the contract says, for the general contractors, or are we approving
$250,000 per contractor?
MR. WELDY: Madam Mayor, and Madam Vice Mayor, if I may? And I did not catch that.
The contract that you're looking at, that second number is inaccurate. So I most likely
loaded the wrong agreement for an example there. But what we are asking for tonight
is 250. Having said that, keep in mind that over the last several months -- and this
started last calendar year -- we discussed several different thresholds and dollar
amounts, and it's likely that I missed that amount whenever I was loading that
document for review.
VICE MAYOR KALIVIANAKIS: Okay. So when these contracts go out, they'll be revised,
I'm assuming?
WELDY: Absolutely. Staff will reread them and --
VICE MAYOR KALIVIANAKIS: Okay.
WELDY: -- make sure they're accurate, and then we will send them out for execution.
VICE MAYOR KALIVIANAKIS: Oh, okay. Terrific. Then the other thing. I realize that
these contracts are for emergency or exigent circumstances; that's why you'd have to
get somebody out of bed at night. But I just wanted to confirm that if there are no
emergency or exigent circumstances regarding these contracts they will go out to bid,
just like any normal contract; is that correct?
WELDY: Madam mayor, Councilmember. We will certainly utilize them should we have
an emergency or a last-minute repair. However, when a project -- let's just pick a capital
project; staff will develop a scope and send that scope to each one of the qualifying
vendors --
VICE MAYOR KALIVIANAKIS: Right.
WELDY: -- on this list and allow them to provide a price for that. And then the staff,
along with procurement and finance, will determine whether or not that is in the best
interest of the monies and the project and proceed from there.
VICE MAYOR KALIVIANAKIS: Exactly. So just because we're pre-approving these funds
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doesn't mean that the taxpayers are just going to pay for a no-bid contract. It's still
going to follow the procedures?
WELDY: Correct. And we're asking for approval of the contract with no funding
attached to them. The funding will come, as I described, for each individual project.
We'll develop a scope and send that to the qualifying vendors.
VICE MAYOR KALIVIANAKIS: Okay. Those are my questions. Thank you.
WELDY: You're welcome.
MAYOR DICKEY: Thank you. We have a motion and a second. Can we have a roll call,
please?
MENDENHALL: Councilmember McMahon?
MCMAHON: Aye.
MENDENHALL: Councilmember Toth?
TOTH: Aye.
MENDENHALL: Councilmember Friedel?
FRIEDEL: Aye.
MENDENHALL: Councilmember Skillicorn?
SKILLICORN: Yes.
MENDENHALL: Councilmember Grzybowski?
GRZYBOWSKI: Aye.
MENDENHALL: Vice Mayor Kalivianakis?
KALIVIANAKIS: Aye.
MENDENHALL: Mayor Dickey?
MAYOR DICKEY: Aye. Thank you. Thanks, Justin.
WELDY: You're welcome.
MAYOR DICKEY: Our next item is going to be discussing our pavement management
planning. A lot of information here, and we look forward to a good discussion. Thank
you.
WELDY: Madam Mayor, Councilmembers. We're back tonight to discuss next year,
which is, believe it or not, in just a few days now. Over the last several months, town
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manager and staff have come to the mayor and council, and we have discussed
numerous different paving options and presented not only the findings of Roadway
Asset Services, but the Citizens Advisory Committee recommendations. We've gone
over several different options in regards to funding, but now we're actually up to the
selection so we can get ready and be prepared for next year.
The first couple of slides here is going to be covering what was approved by the council
and undertaken by the staff for the current year. These are the projects that were
approved by the mayor and council and undertaken by the staff. You've seen these
several times before. This is the last one that was done here, which is the bright
green -- Panorama.
As you can see from the slide, the approved budget was 5.2 million. Utilizing that
budget, we were able to pave 8.98 lane miles. A little caveat there; we also created that
same amount of bike lanes without adding any additional width or making any
substantial changes to our roadway presence. We spent a total of 4.3 million. There is
an unspent fund balance of $900,000.
We're going to spend just a little bit of time and discuss that. When staff comes to the
mayor and council and asks for contract amendments or for them to select road
segments to receive different types of treatment, we are very conservative in our
estimates. There's a reason for that. There are a series of unknowns that could impact
the final cost. So we always like to have a little leeway in there should we need it.
In this particular case, there is a pretty substantial savings, and we were able to
accomplish the goals. That's what we try to do every single year. And at least for the
past, well, decade, we've managed to accomplish those goals and not spend all of the
budget but have that little bit of a buffer zone there should we need it.
Are there any questions related to the projects that we've undertaken or the funding for
this year before we move in to next year?
GOODWIN: Justin, Mayor, if I may? I was going to ask Justin to clarify one piece of what
you just shared. One of the questions that we've received was, well, if you have
900,000 that you didn't spend, couldn't we go do an extra road or two, or couldn't we
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tackle one more thing? Justin, can you clarify and explain why that isn't something we
can do?
WELDY: Madam Mayor and the manager, each year -- and in fact, already this year,
several weeks ago -- we send out the exhibits that you are about to see to all of the
utilities and allow them an opportunity to review those locations and determine
whether or not they have any capital projects or other associated projects in those
areas. After we do pavement treatment, we have a five-year moratorium on going in
there and cutting it up unless it's an emergency. We work with the utilities, and if they
do have a capital project, we will defer or delay that project one or more years,
depending on the size of the project. So while we indeed did have $900,000 left over,
we already had selected enough roads to spend the entire budget, and $900,000
wouldn't get us a long ways, but it also leaves that buffer. So we can only technically
work on the roads that were selected by the mayor and council, and those locations are
shared with the utilities.
The last thing we want to do is spend the people's money and get a brand new road,
and then have hundreds of feet of trench go down that new road. That answer your
question?
FRIEDEL: Justin, did you find any surprises on those roads? I mean, was there less work
on some of them? Is that why we have an unspent fund balance? Were there any
pleasant surprises that you found when you did that road work?
WELDY: Madam Mayor, Councilmember, indeed. We discovered that several of the
roads that had been slated for full-depth reconstruction -- that's the asphalt and up to
eight to ten inches of the subgrade removed and replaced -- we discovered that several
of those roads, in fact, only needed the asphalt removed, plus about one inch of the
subgrade so we could meet our subdivision standard. Not all of them met that, but I
would say right around 60 percent. There were some of them that were a little more
challenging; a couple of examples are Panorama. On Panorama, after we stripped away
the asphalt and some of the subgrade, we discovered that there were some clay
pockets -- expansive soils. So we had the contractor remove a percentage of that and
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then blend it with other stabilizing materials and put it back. Those things are in our
contingency, cost a little bit more money, but we were still able to accomplish the goal.
We'll move into the FY '25. So as you can see, there are seven areas within the town
that have been selected. The first few slides we are going to look at were selected last
year and refined this year by the data collected by Roadway Asset Services, that was
tied directly to our pavement assessment.
This is area 1, up in the northern part of town. And this is Marathon, and it's important
for me to take just a minute here. You'll note that not all of Marathon is shown as green
on this. The reason for that is the northwestern section of Marathon is in much better
condition. Historically, that's because it was built later, and then after that there was a
utility project in there, and any utility project that is 330 feet in length parallel to the
curb requires them to then crack fill and slurry seal that area. This is a good location
where that has happened in the past, so that road is in pretty good condition because
one of the utility companies applied a treatment in-between our typical treatments.
This is area 2. Again, we're in the north section of town, in this case closer to the north
central. As you can see, this is Scorpion. And then just a little piece of Bumblebee
there. You'll also note that the estimated cost for rehabilitation is also on these sheets.
We'll get to some totals as we move forward.
Area 3; this is where those broken up sections get to be a little more challenging. The
staff works as a team to determine whether or not we want to follow the
recommendations of Roadway Asset Services, or if we do a visual inspection of some of
the areas and perhaps eliminate one short road and add it to one of the longer ones so
we can complete a section. We've done some of that for some of these. However, you
got to be real careful what you start picking and choosing because it modifies the data,
and it creates challenges for the future. As you can see, there are several residential
roads on this and a minor collector.
Area 4; this is Gunsight. You're going to see Gunsight and a couple of others two times
tonight. Please note, this section that is on the west end of Gunsight was repaved as
part of a subdivision that was built there when they had to come and extend all the
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utilities. It's in better condition than the section that's shown in green.
This is area 5. Most people are not even aware of some of these. So this is Ridgeway,
which runs off of Palisades, and then Winchester, which is a little short section there.
Area 6. We are certainly all familiar with this. Trevino is another one of these that is
going to show up two times tonight. You will hear from the residents that live on the
southeast portion of Trevino that their road is in as worse, if not -- or as bad or worse
condition than the areas that we're showing you on the northwest section. Again, this
was selected by the software and the data from the information gathered during the
assessment. There is a section on the lower part, adjacent to the fast food restaurants
and the medical facility that was repaved as part of a fuel spill a few years ago.
This is area 7.
All of these, collectively, are $4.8 million if we undertake them using the guidelines and
the adopted policies, procedures, and plans that we currently have in place.
The next ones that we're going to be looking at these sections are result of information
received from the residents: numerous calls, emails, texts, right here at this podium to
the council members and the staff.
Indian Wells, which is the first one there, it's a short section that runs from a part of
Saguaro on the south to just north there. Kingstree: This is one of the ones we've
discussed numerous times in the past, in which I have stood right here and noted this
really needs to be narrowed, because it's a 60-foot wide road, and it needs to have
sidewalks and bike lanes and parking lanes added to reduce the overall cost of future
construction. But more importantly, it's an excellent form of traffic calming.
Palomino. This is one that we've certainly received a considerable amount of phone
calls, texts, emails, and people standing right here at this podium.
This is Richwood. Richwood has a few local residents, and we understand them. We've
been to each of these locations multiple times over the years to do pothole repair. I'm
going to stop just briefly.
So Richwood is an excellent candidate. It is in such poor condition that it needs to be
reconstructed, and it's a little bit expensive to do that. Keep in mind that the public
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works staff, including the two town engineers, the street superintendent, we went out
and did a geotechnical testing, and that's what those red dots are there. That's where
we dug down mechanically and examined the subgrade to determine what kind of
treatment would be necessary when we were working on these estimates.
Here's Trevino, and remember we discussed that they would be showing up. This is one
that shows up two times. So this is selected by the Roadway Asset Services data and
also from the residents and council. You'll see that in this case, it's the entire thing all
the way from Fountain Hills Boulevard to Saguaro.
MAYOR DICKEY: Real quick. The Trevino that's on this slide, does that take into account
what was on the other one then? So that if they did all of Trevino, it would be the two
million?
WELDY: Yes, Madam Mayor.
MAYOR DICKEY: Okay.
WELDY: All of Trevino would be approximately $2 million.
MAYOR DICKEY: Okay.
MCMAHON: So that would change the balance sheet here? The partial Trevino would
go away for 995?
WELDY: That is correct.
MCMAHON: Okay. Thank you.
MR. WELDY: You're welcome.
FRIEDEL: I have a question on Trevino.
WELDY: Yes, sir.
FRIEDEL: Did you do any examination of that road to see how bad it is?
WELDY: Yes, we did.
FRIEDEL: Okay.
WELDY: We went out there and dug some holes, and there are portions of it that are in
relatively good condition. There are some other spots that we'll need to examine as we
get closer, if it's selected.
FRIEDEL: Thank you.
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WELDY: This is El Lago. This runs from La Montana down to Palisades. We've received
a number of emails and phone calls related to the section near the war memorial. We
do a lot of pothole repair there. It also just happens to be a sump where rainwater and
other discharged waters from various sources pool. We worked on it over the years to
try and get it to drain as best as possible.
This is Gunsight. This is another one of those that appears two different times. All of
these total $14.4 million. So what we're here tonight is to get direction on which of
these roads the council would like to select. It should be noted that since incorporation,
the town has always had a paving plan. For the longest time it was the zone approach --
the town had seven zones, and they spent the money to the best of their ability at that
time to address the needs of each of those zones. It took seven years, approximately, to
get around. Oftentimes the funding ran short, but the next year they didn't come back
and finish zone 1, they just started working on zone 2, and so on. And so oftentimes a
single zone might not receive complete treatment ever because they started in the
same place every time.
As part of that zone approach, staff came to the previous mayor and council and asked
them to allocate some funding in 2012, '13, '14 and allow us to stop doing any work for
on zone 2 until we could build up some funding. At that time, the mayor and council
allocated some additional funding. That was a result of some reduction in staff, vehicle
license, and some of the sales tax. The approach was still the zone approach at that
time. However, we went in and repaved and completed that zone.
Then there was additional discussions regarding either a five- or ten-year policy and
plan. We worked considerable amount of time looking at the Stantec Report and then
another vendor's report. After having looked at that, then we began to utilize the
optimized prioritization process, which takes the amount of funding you have, the type
of treatment, and prioritizes it on all of the classifications, primarily starting with arterial
and then collectors and local.
We have been utilizing that approach for the last several years for a couple of reasons.
One, we have clear data and the ability to go out and look at each of these segments
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and make decisions based on the best pavement management practices. Two, it allows
the decision-making to be made by the data and the finances. When we stray away
from that and we start handpicking roads, we are setting a precedence. And that's the
direction that some, but not all of the residents are going to look for. If we paved one,
we're going to need to look at paving another.
These are tough decisions, and I'm right there with you, because we'll be out in the field
based on your decisions tonight, undertaking these locations.
MCMAHON: I have a question about Trevino, again, if you don't mind. On the RAS
software selected portion of it for 995, is that the portion near the medical center that
you're talking about, the worst part of that street?
WELDY: No, ma'am. The worst part of it, based on the Roadway Asset data, is on the
western end of it, so not quite half of it.
MCMAHON: Okay. Thank you.
MAYOR DICKEY: One of the things that we talked about all along has been following this
pattern that makes 100 percent of sense to be trying to offset some of these streets
before they got to the point where they would need to be completely rebuilt, and we
accepted that. But obviously, the some of the input that we get is what about
Palomino, Kingstree, and such. So this is why when we talked about a combination of
the citizens and the RAS, why we came up with with this.
And I guess my original thought, like, let's just take Palomino as an example, which is
obviously a big chunk of the five million. It wouldn't be to say, let's do one of these over
here on the right and then start picking the ones on the left, because you have criteria
for which ones were picked and they were data driven. And obviously, some of those
would be removed if we included one of the larger projects. But I think when it comes
to those streets, they could be looked at as a staff level, because you talk about how
many potholes you've had to -- or how much attention some of these streets have
needed, or some of them are, you know, 38s or so they're the lowest -- or some of them
there's been more insurance claims about -- or what's the traffic count? So part of my
decision-making or trying to make a decision, is to see if there is a way to say, okay, let's
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do Palomino. That leaves whatever it would end up leaving if we put that out for a bid.
Then, not us going in and picking these other streets on the left but continuing for that
to be still part of the program, for lack of a better word. Obviously, some of them would
drop off. But I think what you probably need from us would be, okay, we obviously can
do everything on the left, which is the plan, but we also know the frustration of folks
who travel on some of these streets that have more people on them. They're not
neighborhood streets. And can we possibly handle one of those?
And then in the back of my mind, maybe this is rose-colored glasses, but you were able
to save and if you started on Palomino, and maybe not every bit of it is going to have to
be rebuilt. Or maybe we are going to concentrate on the driving portion, and then the
other side, we can do the -- like we do with El Lago, which ended up not being as much
as we thought it was going to be. And then to finish the thought, taking some funding
from some other areas, contingency, or maybe a project or something else where I feel
like we could come up with some more funding to help with what we might end up
having to drop off of that left side. So those are just my initial thoughts. I don't know
which -- I mean, obviously if we did Trevino and Gunsight, you're immediately saving 1.7
million on that side, which is kind of awesome. But is that what everybody's thinking?
So I just wanted to kind of start the discussion.
Councilman? Councilwoman.
MCMAHON: Thank you very much. I know that this is really a difficult subject and a
difficult decision, I mean, just looking at the math and the numbers and looking at the
sheet. If we do follow the data, the science, and the budget as selected, then it looks
like the $4.8 million, we get more bang for our buck in the sense that we cover a lot
more streets, a lot more repair that affect the whole town. Also these streets on the
data selection, they have the poorest rating. They -- the streets on the public selected
look like their ratings are a little bit higher as far as the PCI ratings. So I think that we
can't forget that, and we need to take that into the equation if we're going to change
anything from the software data driven. I mean, that's what the Streets Committee was
formed for. That's why we spent all this money being data driven so that it can provide
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direction and optimize our budget funds. So I'm a little bit reluctant to change it, but I'd
like to hear more discussion on it. Thank you.
MAYOR DICKEY: Councilwoman?
TOTH: Hi. So I agree; I would like to lean on the data that we were provided. I am
excited to see that a couple of those streets do match up with what we've heard from
the public. Obviously, Palomino needs a lot of work, but that's taking out a significant
chunk of this year's budget. I would think maybe for Kingstree, considering that you
recommend that that be narrowed and have sidewalks, would it be realistic to look at
that as a capital project for fiscal year 20 -- I almost said '26 -- '26.
MR. WELDY: Madam Mayor, Councilmember, absolutely. We can certainly put it in the
capital projects. And it's going to take, obviously, a little while of planning, but if that's
the direction of the mayor and council, we can certainly look at that location for that
use.
MAYOR DICKEY: Councilwoman?
KALIVIANAKIS: Thank you, Ms. Mayor. And just to just to clarify, Rachael, tonight we're
not actually voting on any particular streets being repaired, just how to go forward; is
that correct?
GOODWIN: The hope is that we get direction tonight on which streets we want to do as
part of the FY '25. Because as Justin mentioned earlier, as soon as we get that final
decision, we'll be sending out notices to all of the different utilities and whatnot. And
they need, let's say, a six-month window to do any repairs or any projects they're going
to do and get back to us. And then we begin mobilizing, let's say, December time frame.
So it is in our best interest to make a decision so that we can begin moving forward on
next year's progress.
VICE MAYOR KALIVIANAKIS: Okay. Because when I was preparing for this agenda item I
was thinking in terms of the process by which we go forward to make these
determinations, whether we were going to listen to the RAS report, which is kind of the
computer, the brain, telling us humans how we should be acting; is it driven by the
constituents and the people that live there and their input like here, the council, public
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streets? And so what I was hoping that we could arrive at tonight was a process by
which we could use to be all inclusive.
If you look at the Streets Committee, that they would like to do a fix-it-all approach,
which that's what we would all like to do. But if we don't get that 50 million, if we don't
get that bond, then we have to, like everybody acknowledged here tonight, these are
some pretty tough decisions that people are going to take very personally. And so I kind
of did a flow chart. That would be my thought process. And I think the first thing I think
we do take the RAS report into account. Those are the prioritized roads that we know
are problematic. But I think the second thing we do is we get the citizen input, which I
think we've been doing to determine what are their highest priority roads. And so we
kind of merge the machine with the human element. And that's when we rely on staff
next.
So then the staff would take the RAS report, the public input, and then they would
merge that with the actual usage and what roads are more used than not; safety
concerns, which roads are unsafe by design, or we are getting a lot of insurance claims
or a lot of complaints about accidents or something because of big potholes or
whatever, check insurance claims, that sort of thing. After we we take that into
account, then I think we consult with the Streets Committee and say, this is kind of our
rough draft of the streets that we are looking to get repaired. That would be the
number 4 in my flow chart.
The 5th would be -- that would be coming down back to the Public Works Department.
Why you get paid the big money, and you're the expert, to take all those considerations
and then analyze them with the town manager, go in the field, which obviously you've
done because you've done all the poking in the holes and stuff. And then and then you
make it a determination of based on the reports, based on this, based on safety, you
give us recommendations. I think that's the best way to do it.
If the recommendations come from council, then it might be looked at as tainted, like,
well, it might be your neighbor or your friend, and you're just trying to get other
people's roads fixed. I don't want it to have a political element. And I think if it does
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come from councilmembers, there's a chance that it could be political or at least
perceived as political.
And then based on that, then you have your recommendations, we proceed. So that
would be my way to do it, even though I know I'm not picking roads tonight and what to
fix. But I think going forward, these are all considerations that we need to make. So
we're mindful of the money we spent in the road report, but also of our constituents
concerns, safety concerns, and of course how much traffic is on these roads. You know,
we should be fixing the ones with the most traffic first. And so anyway, that's my two
cents.
WELDY: Madam Mayor and Madam Vice Mayor, in regards to the public input, we have
weeded through that considerably. And what we have tonight is a very, very small
percentage. There is a lot more out there, but we had to kind of make some tough
decisions behind the scenes based on the information we received, their capacity, and
the number of texts and emails. So if we go back to the public, that list is going to grow
substantially. On the right.
VICE MAYOR KALIVIANAKIS: Yeah, I can appreciate that. One of the roads. Yesterday
actually got in my car, and I drove most of these roads. And the one I'm confused about
is Kingstree. I know it's very wide, and I know there's no bike lanes, but it seems like a
pretty adequate road. There's very few potholes, very few cracks. Just in your expert --
why is Kingstree making this list?
WELDY: It falls into the 38.5 PCI range. So it's the pavement condition index puts it very
near the bottom in regards to condition. And it's oftentimes difficult to come to that
conclusion when you're driving on it, because we have to take the entire length of the
road into consideration and then average those. And it's one of the older roads, if you
would, in the town. So it's in relatively poor condition in regards to the standards that
are adopted.
VICE MAYOR KALIVIANAKIS: Right. And then, you'd spoken about Richmond, which is
obviously north on Boulder. And I looked at all those roads, too, and actually talked to
some of the homeowners. And some of the roads that are in green, the cul de sacs and
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stuff, and I said it's going to be 280,000 or 180,000 to fix the road in front of your house,
if it will be worth it. And they're like, no, but if you want to fix Richmond, fix Richmond,
which is on your list. And then Dixie Mine, they complained about it. The hill at Dixie
mine, I didn't have a chance to drive there. But anyways, I'm just saying that -- again,
some of the RAS reported streets that needed repairs, the neighborhood residents
didn't seem to think they were in bad shape. But again, maybe the experts know based
on preventing future damage and preventative maintenance.
But anyway, that's just kind of what I discovered yesterday in looking at the roads. And
Kingstree is still a mystery to me.
MAYOR DICKEY: Councilman?
SKILLICORN: Thank you, Madam Mayor, Director. I actually think it's wise to take
somewhat of a blended approach. I love the data analysis; we can actually compare the
PCI numbers, the ratings. That's very helpful. It's a great tool. But I also look at we are
accountable to the people. And I'd like to give them something.
And frankly, when I look at this, I see there's a couple of the public supported streets
that have very low PCI, which are effectively tied with some of the others that are on
the RAS list. And I do notice that one of them is one of the least expensive. I also do
recall at the end of the last fiscal year, I don't want to say we had leftover funds, but we
did spend a little less than what we had originally thought. And I kind of wonder if we
challenge staff to do more with less about adding something like Indian Wells in there.
It's one of the least expensive. It's tied for the one of the lowest PCIs. I think that would
be an appropriate one to add in addition to the RAS streets. So I would actually be even
willing to make a motion to do the RAS streets, plus Indian Wells. I think that would be
a good start for the next year and effectively asking staff, let's see if we can do more
with less.
TOTH: I am interested in that, but I have a question. How much do we have to spend?
WELDY: Madam Mayor, Councilmember, we have $5 million budgeted.
TOTH: Okay. So we have .2 -- well, 200,000 in flexibility. Indian Wells is 588,000. I'm
tempted to do that. But I do agree with your earlier feedback that maybe the if we
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were to pick and choose a couple out of that, we'd end up with a small little street over
here that needs help, and all the ones around it look brand new. And the people on that
street -- I mean, if I lived on that street, I wouldn't be too thrilled watching all of my
neighbors get nice new roads. But I understand where it's coming from, and I do like
the idea. I do think that at least we have Trevino and Gunsight on there. Those are two
that I've had a lot of people call me about, as well as Palomino. I think it's unfortunate
that Palomino is going to be a very expensive project. I do want to kind of give -- I don't
know if we're ending the conversation yet but ending the conversation on a positive
note. That list on the left is 9.75 lane miles; is that correct?
WELDY: Yes, ma'am.
TOTH: That's a fantastic amount of space that we're able to fix in a single year. And I
think that it's exciting to see that the data does match up to what the public is saying. I
think some of these other roads can absolutely be on our radar for next year. I would
really love to see Palomino done. That might take a miracle, but I know that a lot of
people have been talking about it. Anyway, I'll quit rambling.
MAYOR DICKEY: Councilwoman?
MCMAHON: Thank you. Oh, my God, I forgot what I was going to say. I like the data-
driven side of it because this is just estimates, correct? I mean, the four million, eight,
it's -- given that it's estimates, it's bound that you hit the five million, easy. And in
addition, given the status of these streets with the PCI, it's going to be even -- if we
ignore any of those, it's going to even be even more expensive later on to fix these
streets. I mean, I do believe, and I appreciate our constituents' input, but I also think
that that is taken into consideration. And I know based upon our conversations that
you've gone through, and staff have gone through a huge amount of data about that,
which is what you have listed on the side.
But to me, the fact of the matter is, is we can't afford to spend four million on King
Street and Palomino and ignore the other streets. Because if we do that, then we've got
a $4.8 million problem on the left. That's probably going to be 6.8 million if we wait a
year or two years on these streets. So I prefer the data driven and I -- and then if we
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don't use all of those funds, like, for example, there's 900,000 that you didn't use that
we pick a street on the right-hand side that, okay, if we have enough left over and we
can find possibly additional funds in the budget, then we select like Indian Wells or
another street over there as a priority, but always keeping in mind that depending upon
how this works out in reality, always keeping in mind the streets on the right, and if we
have an opportunity to fix any portion of those with excess funds, then we do that.
That's my suggestion.
FRIEDEL: I also like the data driven. It's factual. It's there in black and white. But my
question is, if we do any other addition to that rather than Indian Wells, could we
consider -- this council consider doing the road down by the memorial? That's our
namesake park. I mean, everybody that goes there sees that area, and that's in such
rough shape. Is it possible to do a partial work down that area? You've got some
parcels in here now. I think it would add a lot to getting that cleaned up down there.
MR. WELDY: Madam Mayor and Councilmember, we can certainly reduce the amount
of work done on El Lago and concentrate on the portion between Saguaro and
Panorama, if that's the direction.
MAYOR DICKEY: So we could basically -- so El Lago is 1.53 on that side. But if we just did
that one part -- because we really have heard a lot about that. Kingstree, like you're
saying, it's not that much, and that one's only a 42 -- I mean Indian Wells. But in fact,
Kingstree also has sections that are down to 42. And then there's even a 34 here. So we
would continue with everything that's on the left and -- on the left side of the chart.
And then I think that it feels like we would agree that we would be able to do the Indian
Wells and then the part of El Lago kind of based on, like I said before, the fact that we
did find some streets that didn't need quite as much. Obviously, it's all going to come
down to what the bids actually come back as. At this point we have a motion, but not a
second for the RAS software selected streets, plus Indian Wells. And we don't have a
second yet, but if we got one, we could have an amendment for El Lago.
TOTH: I'll second that. And then I'll ask Councilman Skillicorn if he's willing to make the
amendment for the portion of El Lago by the Veterans Memorial.
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MAYOR DICKEY: Well, don't amend your own thing, probably, but give her permission.
SKILLICORN: Well, Madam Mayor, Councilwoman, and Councilman, I had the exact
same thought of amending it to the eastern end of El Lago. I think that'd be fabulous.
MAYOR DICKEY: So we'll consider Hannah amending it?
TOTH: Yes.
MAYOR DICKEY: Okay. To include that. Is there a second for that amendment?
FRIEDEL: Second.
MAYOR DICKEY: Okay. So what's on -- we have an amendment to include -- sorry. The
portion of El Lago, which I think we all know what we're talking about. And then we can
approve the motion as amended, correct? I'm looking at you.
QUIST: That's correct. That's correct, Mayor.
WELDY: Madam Mayor, if I may? One more little difficult decision.
MAYOR DICKEY: No, no, no.
MCMAHON: No.
WELDY: We have X amount of funds that we believe we've conservatively estimated
the Roadway Asset Services amount of the treatment. We're selecting two other
segments. I need you to prioritize those segments. If you have funding left over start
on?
MAYOR DICKEY: El Lago.
FRIEDEL: El Lago.
MAYOR DICKEY: If we have funding left over, start on El Lago, but we know we're going
to do them all. And then Indian Wells. And yeah, so we have a motion and a second
and we're probably ready to vote. But I do want to point out that this one-pager here is
about $20 million worth of work that needs to be done. And it's kind of a really stark
illustration of what we've been trying to do here for many, many years. And it's still the
dilemma. It's not really picking one over the other because the Citizens Committee
didn't expect us to make a change this year. This is something that we're trying to do,
because we're trying to listen and get a few more things done. It doesn't really change
the recommendations or the need. So if everyone's ready, we could have a roll call.
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MENDENHALL: Councilmember Toth?
TOTH: Aye.
MENDENHALL: Councilmember Friedel?
MEMBER FRIEDEL: Aye.
MENDENHALL: Councilmember Skillicorn?
SKILLICORN: Yes.
MENDENHALL: Councilmember Grzybowski?
GRZYBOWSKI: Aye.
MENDENHALL: Councilmember McMahon?
MCMAHON: Aye.
MENDENHALL: Vice Mayor Kalivianakis?
VICE MAYOR KALIVIANAKIS: Aye.
MENDENHALL: Mayor Dickey?
MAYOR DICKEY: Aye. Thank you all. Thank you very much. Our next item is our usual
legislative bulletin. We know that they adjourned sine die on Saturday at around 10
o'clock; $16 billion budget, they, by lowering it to that, they eliminated a $1.8 billion
deficit across two years. It wasn't unanimous by any stretch of the imagination. There
were a few things that we got a legislative update today. Take a look at that, because it
points out some of the things that are related to cities and towns.
And this last thing is about a bill which was a sober living home bill 1361, which the
League was very much in favor of, and had passed out of the House 52 to 6, but for
some reason was never scheduled in the Senate. So it's very disappointing because it
paralleled a lot of what we did here. And assuming that our ordinance is still going to be
okay, we didn't do ours pending theirs being able to be a legal thing. But it was -- it's
disappointing because it really did give us a lot of choices there. It gave DHS some
powers over there that they don't have now.
Sir, did you have something?
SKILLICORN: Yes, Madam Mayor. Some of the budget was -- money was freed up to
fund streets, and some of those were capital projects that were budgeted last year as
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the special incentives. There is a very large special incentive that Fountain Hills, or
specifically the Dark Sky Center, received last year. I have not heard any confirmation if
that's included in the sweep or not. That's something that -- like, no one answered to.
Obviously, we may not have an answer now, but that's something we want to keep our
ear to the ground on.
MAYOR DICKEY: Yeah, I did read that. And I did not see that. But we can certainly
confirm that. Just be a little tiny item, right? Okay. So any further discussion on that?
Any council discussion direction to Rachael?
MCMAHON: Have a nice summer.
MAYOR DICKEY: Yeah. We direct you to have a nice summer. Safe and happy summer.
Future agenda. Well, we're not meeting until the 19th of August. Yes, sir.
SKILLICORN: There's something that -- a constituent mentioned something about -- it
was part of the pending zoning, P&Z code, and it's something that I can get some details
over the summer with. But it was specific to the 28-18 on that particular part of our
ordinance or law there. But I can get some details as we go forth this summer.
MAYOR DICKEY: Sounds good. Thanks.
All right. Then again, have a very happy summer and be safe and stay cool and drink
water and all that stuff. And we are adjourned.