HomeMy WebLinkAbout2012.0607.TCSM.Minutes TOWN OF FOUNTAIN HILLS
MINUTES OF THE SPECIAL SESSION OF THE
FOUNTAIN HILLS TOWN COUNCIL
(by. DUNE 7,2012
• CALL TO ORDER AND ROLL CALL
Mayor Kavanagh called the meeting to order at 7:33 p.m. in the Town Hall Council Chambers.
• ROLL CALL
Present for roll call were the following members of the Fountain Hills Town Council: Mayor Kavanagh,
Councilmember Yates, Vice Mayor Leger, Councilmember Brown, Councilmember Elie and Councilmember
Hansen and Councilmember Dickey. Town Manager Ken Buchanan, Town Attorney Andrew McGuire and
Town Clerk Bev Bender were also present.
AGENDA ITEM #1 — PUBLIC HEARING REGARDING RESOLUTION 2012-11, APPROVING THE
ESTIMATES OF EXPENSES, ASSESSMENTS AND THE TENTATIVE BUDGET AS THE FINAL
BUDGET FOR THE 2012-13 FISCAL YEAR BUDGET FOR THE TOWN OF FOUNTAIN HILLS.
Mayor Kavanagh declared the Public Hearing open regarding Resolution 2012-11 @ 7:33 PM.
Town Manager Ken Buchanan addressed the Council relative to this agenda item and said that following his
presentation the Mayor will receive public comment from citizens present. He said that at any time during the
presentation, he and staff welcome questions from the Council. He added that he provided the Council with a
packet last Thursday that contained a number of errors and apologized for that. He said he is the one who put it
together and thanked staff who worked with him to make the necessary corrections.
Mr. Buchanan highlighted the contents of a presentation on the Town of Fountain Hills Proposed Final Budget
2012-13 (Copy available in the office of the Town Clerk). He noted that the Tentative Budget was adopted a
month ago in the amount of$31,552,772 and said that subsequent to that, some reductions have been made and
referred to a chart that listed the proposed total budget in the amount of$31,409,035.
In response to question from Councilmember Dickey, Deputy Town Manager/Finance Director Julie Ghetti
advised that as far as the grant reductions, staff took the actual number less what they had estimated and the
amount was lower so they ended up with available resources (they reduced the amount to balance it to the
available resources).
Mr. Mood also clarified that when they had the Tentative Budget,they received information from the League that
the HURF funds could be reduced so the Tentative Budget included an $110,000 contingency in the Streets
section and that figure has now been reduced down to$12,000.
Councilmember Hansen commented that she is not sure if they can do anything about this but the presentation is
quite comprehensive and as long as Mr. Buchanan has offered to respond to Council's questions as they move
along she sees that Community Partnerships is quite far down in the presentation and she knows that there are a
lot of people present this evening who want to speak on that item. She asked if there was any way they could
jump forward at this time and address that issue/allow discussion if that suggestion receives the support of the
Council.
Mr. Buchanan said that he could certainly move ahead and noted that the next series in the presentation consists
of the contents of staffs budget presentation,the organization chart and personnel (48 full time, 19 part time for a
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total of 64 total employees -- 56.61 FYEs),the various organizational charts for the various departments, the fact
that there is a total of$3,356,731 in personnel and benefits,which reflects savings in health insurance premiums
and Mr. Buchanan's recommendation that staff be provided a 2.5% across-the-board cost-of-living increase
(would not apply to the Town Manager,the Town's Magistrate or the Council). He added that as far as the Debt 'mu)
Review, the total is $11.4 million with the two outstanding bonds. He discussed the Budget Overview and said
that there are 21 sets of books and referred to the chart depicting these and discussed all funds sources ($31.4
million). He said that Community Partnerships is a part of the Administration Department and they can certainly
talk about that if that is the desire of the Council. He added that he has just provided a brief overview of the
presentation leading up to this but if at any time the Council wants to go back and obtain more detailed
information he would be happy to provide that.
Mr.Buchanan advised that the Community Partnerships consist of the following: •
Economic Development/Tourism
Fountain Hills Community Theatre
Fountain Hills Boys&Girls Club
Food Bank
MCSO Posse
Senior Citizens,Inc.
JumpStartBiz
Mr.Buchanan stated that they could start with any one of the Partnerships listed above.
Mayor Kavanagh said that since a lot of people are in attendance to talk about the Community Theatre they can
start with that one.
Town Clerk Bev Bender advised that she has received a large number of cards and provided a breakdown of who
wished to speak, those in support, those in opposition to funding and those who did not wish to speak but
indicated their position on the topic.
The citizens/people listed below spoke in support of the Community Theatre and provided the following
comments/justification: The value of the arts on the entire community and the fact that it serves as a draw
bringing people from other communities; the funding provided by the Town has never been taken for granted;
facts relative to the building that the Theatre currently occupies (copies of facts and various other
information/exhibits were provided to the Council and are on file in the office of the Town Clerk); two buildings
are used and the Community Theatre building is over 30 years old and the Theatre has occupied it for 16 years;
the fact that there are restrictions on the building's use and purpose; timelines and documentation relative to the
Theatre's history and purpose; the building's estimated value of$528,000; copies of petitions signed by over 350
residents in support of the Community Theatre,which were presented to the Council;the fact that despite the fact
that the building is old,thanks to staunch supporters and a lot of fundraising efforts, over$196,000 has been spent
on improvements; if you add on donated materials, etc. that figure just about doubles; significant improvements
that have been made in order to comply with requirements; the fact that repairs and maintenance represent a
significant cost and the Town spent a total of over $2,000 and if the Theatre was not in the building, that cost
would be the sole responsibility of the Town; insurance related costs that are paid by the Theatre and the fact that
the Town would have to pay insurance whether the Theatre occupied that building or not;they have worked hand-
in-hand with other organizations to serve the public; Sunset Kiwanis has helped build many of their sets; and
other organizational buildings that receive support from the Town(and the Boys &Girls Club was given to them
for$1.00 by the School District).
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Additional comments in support included: The Town has always recognized the importance of the arts and what
it brings to a community and provided support for this and their continued development since 1992; the Theatre
L has grown to become the State-wide recognized venue that it is today; funding has always been proportionate to
their budget and has averaged a very reasonable 16% over the years; in FY 2007-08, the annual support was put
into a three-year contract for services (the Theatre would provide youth programs, educational camps and an
additional annual show in the park--events that could not be put on by Parks&Recreation)and in order to put on
the annual park event the Theatre increased its expenses by$25,000 per year;the service contract made it possible
for the first time in the Theatre's history to create a budget with some funding certainty; the Theatre has always
been extremely fiscally responsible; financial documents and audit review results are public record as is the
current balance sheet; the Theatre is reliant on personal and corporate donations as well as grants, and in-house
funding efforts; in order to receive grants,the Theatre must provide proof that the local government supports and
appreciates their operation and recognizes their positive impact on the community; discussion about the
profitability of the Theatre and the fact that the Community Theatre has been one of if not the most fiscally
responsible theatres in the Valley; it is a not-for-profit organization; negative impacts should funding not be
approved,including curtailed services,the possibility of the Theatre not being able to continue; a number of other
theatres in the Valley that have closed over the last few years and the importance of ensuring that the Community
Theatre does not become another art casualty.
Citizens in support also spoke regarding the following: The Fountain Hills Youth Theatre and the artistic value of
the Theatre; they are a non-profit organization that carries out a public/private partnership and contracts with the
Town; their job is to provide services to the community that otherwise would be too cost prohibitive; they offer
low priced,live performances and safe activities as well as a secure meeting place for the Town's youth;the many
opportunities that are offered to those who require performing community service hours; economic development
and the fact that the Community Theatre has been a visitor's destination point for over 26 years; 50% of their
audience comes from outside the Town and use local restaurants, gas stations, etc.; actors/performers from out of
Town also utilize the local services on a regular basis; the fact that the Community Theatre also creates jobs;
awards that have been presented to the various art venues in Town and they are now competing on a national
level; over 200,000 web hits have occurred just this year; the public/private commitment is taken very seriously
by the organization and has proven itself to be a community amenity not only for residents but also for new and
returning visitors; many people are comparing the importance of funding for various community contracts against
repairing Saguaro Boulevard and the fact that if all the funding for the Theatre over the last eight years had been
withheld in its entirety, and assuming it was not spent on something else,the entire amount represents 5%of what
the road repair estimates are; the opinion that the Community Theatre seems to have been singled out as a primary
target yet if they look at the maintenance costs of the other Town-owned buildings, the maintenance of the
statues, the Fountain, etc., the Theatre's expense to the Town is very minimal; if the Council is opposed to
government funding of the arts they should not be talking about just the Theatre and targeting just a few
organizations.
Further comments in support of funding include the following: Many residents chose Fountain Hills as their
home and place to raise their children because of the Town's honest values and amenities --the Theatre being one
of them;benefits that youths have realized as a result of the Theatre's existence and the importance of continuing
that for the Town's youths and well as all residents and visitors; the heavy involvement of youths in the
Community Theatre's programs and positive impacts, including self confidence and self discipline; the Theatre
allows the youths to meet new friends, enhance their abilities and learn skills that will last a lifetime; the fact that
studies have shown that youths who have had exposure to the arts demonstrate higher career goals, are more
engaged, achieve higher grades and perform better on standardized tests; arts involvement tends to increase
college enrollment and completion and a person with a college degree earns more and pays more in taxes; the
perspective of a Town youth on the importance and benefits of the Community Theatre from her own experience
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and that of her peers; the fact that finding funding is a commonplace problem and grant sources are drying up;
non-profit organizations are having to hire grant writers and that comes at a very steep cost;the problem is not as
simple as enhancing marketing and public relations; the arts make difficult times like these palatable and people
need some place to go and enjoy themselves; to not support the Theatre would be barbaric because these are No)
people who make everyone's lives better; the opinion that the Theatre is vital to the cultural wellbeing of the
community; ticket sales only cover one-third of the Theatre's expenses and despite exhaustive and aggressive
marketing efforts and fundraising, donations are down 50%; when parents from out of Town drop their children
off at the Theatre, they spend their money in Fountain Hills; a business owner's perspective on the fact that he
receives support both locally and from people out of Town who come to the Theatre on a regular basis; the
funding is critical to the Theatre's future success.
Val Stasik Pam Aguilu
Stephanie Mcdonald Sandi McGee
Peter Hill Karen Smith
Ross Collins Amy Burnett(left meeting,card indicated support)
Noelle hick Patrick Russo
Randy Beard Kelly Ryan
Joyce Szeliga Lina Bellinar(left the meeting prior to be called to speak)
Leslie Van Valkenberg
Carlie Van Valkenberg
The residents/people listed below spoke in support of the Community Theatre but in opposition to subsidizing the
Theatre with taxpayer dollars and offered the following comments/suggestions:
The residents/people listed below spoke in opposition to funding the Community Theatre and provided the
following comments/justification/suggestions: Some time ago, the Town decided to fund the difference between
what the Theatre was taking in and what it was costing and instead of it being a positive, it became an anchor
because with so many dedicated,hard-working people who made the Theatre what it has become, if they put their
efforts into marketing/sales, fundraising,etc. and get the word out about what the Theatre has done and can do for
this Town the results would be enormous and donations would be forthcoming; Mr. Bordow's willingness to
contribute the first $100 towards that effort and his opinion that many; many citizens would do the same; a
suggestion to start a foundation or an endowment for the Theatre; the fact that the Town is giving them the
buildings does show the Town's support for the arts and should allow the organizations to qualify for grants; the -
fact that the Community Theatre is an extraordinary venue that brings people to Town and significant hours and
dollars are volunteered to this organization; for over 26 years, the Theatre has been enjoying an enormous
partnership and support from the Town in the form of free rental benefits, subsidized building maintenance,
insurance, $70,000+ annually in cash, etc.; 26 years ago the Theatre was just starting out and needed a lot of
support from the Town, which it received but now it is healthy, prosperous and a revenue generating adult with
thousands of admirers and a great reputation both in and outside of the Town; it is time for government to stop
subsidizing this venue and Mr. Lvov's willingness to pledge $500 to the Community Theatre should the Town
funding not be approved; the Theatre is a wonderful organization and an important part in the development of the
Town's youth as well as the enjoyment of all members of the community who want to participate but the Town is
responsible for roads,safety,sewer and water;the Theatre doesn't fall into those categories and Town finances are
very lean -- they have been cutting everywhere they can -- and there are still some places to cut; the Theatre
should be paying rent and contributing more to the maintenance (not in favor of giving funds); the Theatre
members and those who support it need to support that organization and not the taxpayers; and a request to
withdraw at least the funding for the Theatre; the fact that the Community Theatre is a private organization that
receives substantial public money (over $690,000 over the past five years from the Town -- a great deal for a
private organization with public money); if funding is approved other organizations should have the right to
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request and demand similar funding from the Town such as Little League Baseball, youth soccer teams, etc; the
legal importance of taking care of streets, roads and public safety but public support of a private organization is
not a legal requirement of the Town; in view of the Town's situation with regard to its roads, regardless of a
private organization's worth, this needs to be critically examined; the importance of determining the "nice to
haves"versus the"must haves;" and the importance of the proper use of public funds;the use of public monies for
private enterprises and the fact that although it was great that the Town could provide funding in the past,just like
everyone else, the Town has to cut back when times are bad; the importance of evaluating carefully and
determining what the Town is getting for its dollars; the Theatre gets to use the building at a very reasonable rent
and they have to be careful with all organizations that they do not cross the line between enablement and
entitlement; taxpayer money should not pay for private enterprise and the Theatre should become self supporting;
art takes on many different forms but where is funding for bowling alleys, martial arts and other after school
activities -- it doesn't exist and it shouldn't; the opinion that they can't put a price on the raising of the children in
Fountain Hills; there is not an abundant number of things and activities for youths to do in Town and the Theatre
plays an extremely important part in their lives.
Peter Bordow
Linda Bordow
Nancy Ordowski
Gary Lvov
Rich Rutkowski
Sharon Hutchinson
Dennis Reed
Kelly Ryan
The following citizens/people submitted cards but did not wish to speak on the item(if they indicated their
position on the card it has been noted):
Dianna&John Pierce Against funding the Theatre with public money
Sharon DuBose Against using taxpayer money to fund the arts
Dennis DuBose Against—Town funds need to be used for real expenses
Todd Carrie Supports funding the Theatre
Susan Obst-Dworkis Checked Against but comments indicate support
Linda Wilk Supports funding the Theatre
Peter Wilk Supports funding the Theatre
Patricia Johnson Supports funding the Theatre
Illegible Name Supports funding the Theatre
MaryBeth Ingram Supports funding the Theatre
Michael Druckman Supports funding the Theatre
Patricia Druckman Supports funding the Theatre
Dominic Mazzotta Supports funding the Theatre
Gordon& Susan Griggs Supports funding the Theatre
Ginger Ryan Supports funding the Theatre
Benoit Torrilhon Supports funding the Theatre
Patricia Torrilhon Supports funding the Theatre
Stephen Mancarella Supports funding the Theatre
Karl Gaardsmoe Supports funding the Theatre
Char Aschenbrenner Supports funding the Theatre
Bill Vesfal Supports funding the Theatre
Donna Georgette Supports funding the Theatre
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Rachel Smith Supports funding the Theatre
Loen Orson Supports funding the Theatre
Leah Klein Supports funding the Theatre
Susan Harding Supports funding the Theatre `9411)
Alexandra Bice Supports funding the Theatre
Devin Derr Supports funding the Theatre
Alisa Feugate Supports funding the Theatre
Robert Feugate Supports funding the Theatre
C.D.Titus Supports funding the Theatre
Carrie Grief Supports funding the Theatre
Janet Moyse Supports funding the Theatre
Patrick Moyse Supports funding the Theatre
Connor Maddox Supports funding the Theatre
Logan Barrett Supports funding the Theatre
Kathryn Male • Supports funding the Theatre
Mary Ann Hacker Supports funding the Theatre
Summer Beckman Supports funding the Theatre
Paige Beckman Supports funding the Theatre
Clint Sekul Supports funding the Theatre
Robert Shulte Supports funding the Theatre
Fred Rhoades Supports funding the Theatre
Deloris Shulte Supports funding the Theatre
Shireen Rhoades Supports funding the Theatre
Laura Bice Supports funding the Theatre
Daniel Fecteau Supports funding the Theatre
Wendel Wilhelmi Supports funding the Theatre
Alison Hacker Supports funding the Theatre
Judy Simmonds Supports funding the Theatre
Donna Beers Supports funding the Theatre
Laura Tuazon Supports funding the Theatre
Meagan Tuazon Supports funding the Theatre
Anonymous Supports funding the Theatre
Eileen Boulander Supports funding the Theatre
Catherine Quinn Supports funding the Theatre
Frank Bye,Sr. Supports funding the Theatre
Haylee Klein Supports funding the Theatre
Wally Nichols Supports funding the Theatre,Boys&Girls Club,&the Food Bank
Sheila Nichols Supports funding the Theatre,Boys&Girls Club,&the Food Bank
Edith Stock States cash funding of the Theatre should be cut but wants continued funding for
the Food Bank and the Boys&Girls Club
Barbara Patterson Supports funding the Theatre,Food Bank and the Boys&Girls Club
Rachael Barrett Supports funding the Theatre
Nick Maddox Supports funding the Theatre
Zachary Percevecz Supports funding the Theatre
Lorin Collins Supports funding the Theatre
Anne Collins Supports funding the Theatre
Jane Collins Supports funding the Theatre
Estelle Mazzotta Supports funding the Theatre
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Lindsey Garland Supports funding the Theatre
Alice Brovan Supports funding the Theatre,Boys&Girls Club,and Food Bank
Albert Smith Supports funding the Theatre,Boys&Girls Club,and Food Bank
Vanessa Davisson Supports funding the Theatre,Boys&Girls Club,and Food Bank
Verina Creta Supports funding the Theatre and Boys&Girls Club
D. DeRose Supports funding the Theatre
Marlene Jackson Supports funding the Theatre
Debbie Vinopal Supports funding the Theatre
Tom Vinopal Supports funding the Theatre
Bev Tall Supports funding the Theatre
Jodie Ginef Supports funding the Theatre
Madelyn Varda Supports funding the Theatre
Anne Kelleher Supports funding the Theatre,Boys&Girls Club,and Food Bank
Clifford Lentz Supports funding the Theatre,Boys&Girls Club,and Food Bank
Mayor Kavanagh said that since it is getting really late, she would like to know if they can continue on with the
rest of the budget issues on Tuesday and Mr. Buchanan said that that if that is the desire of the Council they can
certainly do that.
Discussion ensued relative to closing the public hearing and Town Attorney Andrew McGuire said that it is the
Council's prerogative but they definitely want to close the public hearing because they want to start the time
period between now and the adoption but whatever else the Council wants to do is up to them.
Mayor Kavanagh asked the members of the Council how they felt about closing the public hearing and moving on
so that the Council can comment on the contract.
Councilmember Leger stated that the previous Council has been working on this budget since December of 2011
and Council candidates have had basically the same materials he has had as an incumbent. He expressed the
opinion that they should be able to move through the rest of the presentation and look at adopting the budget. He
added that if a majority of the Council does not feel comfortable with what is being proposed they certainly can
make amendments. He suggested that they take a short break and continue on.
Councilmember Hansen recommended that they close the public hearing and then discuss where they want to go
from there.
Mr.McGuire reiterated that this is the prerogative of the Council.
Mayor Kavanagh declared the public hearing closed at 8:44 p.m.
AGENDA ITEM #2 - CONSIDERATION OF RESOLUTION 2012-11, APPROVING THE ESTIMATES
OF EXPENSES, ASSESSMENTS AND THE TENTATIVE BUDGET AS THE FINAL BUDGET FOR
THE 2012-13 FISCAL YEAR BUDGET FOR THE TOWN OF FOUNTAIN HILLS.
Councilmember Brown MOVED to approve Resolution 2012-11,approving the amended Tentative Budget as the
Final Budget for the 2012-13 Fiscal Year budget for the Town of Fountain Hills ($31,409,035) and
Councilmember Yates SECONDED the motion.
(by Councilmember Dickey indicated a conflict of interest and left the dais at 8:46 PM.
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Mayor Kavanagh said that she doesn't know where people got the idea that she wanted to close the Theatre but
her concern is with the tax money. She added that she first wants to talk about the building and what the building
is worth. She noted that regardless of whether they can sell the building or rent the building the important issue is
the value of the building because it is something that belongs to the taxpayers. She said that the value of the
building should be considered especially since the Theatre is the only organization that gets both a building with
maintenance/repairs and a small insurance policy. She pointed out that there are other organizations that use
public buildings but they don't get any money.
The Mayor advised that she had some commercial real estate people do some work for her and reported that the
total square footage of the building is 9,880 square feet(for two buildings). She stated that she used 9,000 square
feet as the guide and had someone run some comps on it and the lowest figure was that the building was worth
$700,000 and the highest figure was $970,000. She said that just says that if the Theatre had to go someplace else
that is what they would have to pay for a commercial structure of that size in Fountain Hills. She added that to
rent a structure of comparable size she got a lot of high numbers but she is going with a low,conservative number
-$7.50 per square foot which amounts to $6,760 a month or$81,000 a year. She pointed out that the value of the
building is there and it belongs to the taxpayers. She added that it could have been given to any group but it was
given for the use of the Theatre. She discussed maintenance and repairs and up to 2008 it was $2,500 but then it
was $5,500 up to 2012. She said it is over$9,000 and the other thing that really concerns her is that according to
a report it appears that because it is an old building, in Fiscal Year 2013-14 they are probably looking at about
$86,000 worth of repairs on the building(the roof and some other things).
Mayor Kavanagh also discussed the insurance policy and said that she is aware of the fact that the Theatre also
has a policy and the cost is low but it adds to the whole grand total of over$706,000. She noted that the Theatre
only pays $1.00 per year and said that is comparable to what other organizations pay. She advised that all for all
of these service contracts the Council requested that they provide a scope of work so they would know exactly
how the money would be used. She said that the Council has received just two pages, one saying that the money
would go towards productions and the second said that the Town's logo would be on some of the advertising and
they would be sponsored for some of the shows. She noted that there were no specifics provided and if you look
at the other service contracts their scopes of work show exactly where every penny is going. She stated that she
believes that some of the members on the Council had demanded that in order to renew some of the contracts they
wanted the groups to provide real specifics on where the money was going to go and how it was going to be used.
Mayor Kavanagh referred to a chart displayed in the Chambers and said last year the Town was underwriting or
subsidizing various plays (five children's plays and two adult plays). She stressed the importance of knowing
where the money goes and highlighted the data contained on the chart. She stated that when she looked down the
expense column she was surprised to see that there are quite a few salaries listed there and if you add up the
salaries and the compensation of one particular play it comes to over $7,000 (so you have a play that brings in
$7,000 and $7,000 goes out in salaries). She continued reading the contents of the various data contained in the
chart showing income that was generated and salaries that were paid, with a large number of the salaries being
more than the money generated for the various presentations.
Mayor Kavanagh advised that she does not have a scope of work to go by and does not know exactly where the
money is going so the only thing she can do is look at last years, which is similar because the money went
towards productions. She said that it shows that a great deal of taxpayer money is going towards salaries and she
questions the use of taxpayer money for something like that. She added that she had always assumed that the
money was going towards set decorations and buying costumes so she was quite surprised to see how much was
going out in salaries. She noted that she wanted to present the value of the building and where the money is
going.
j
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Mayor Kavanagh said that as far as comparisons to some of the other organizations that use public buildings such
as the Kiwanis building that has been brought up several times she thinks they have to remember that the Kiwanis
L Club originally owned the building and they gave it to the Town, not the other way around. She advised that the
agreement was that the Town would cover the maintenance if they gave the Town the building. She said she
thinks that because she said she wanted to look at the value of the building people misunderstood and thought she
wanted to take back the building but she had no thoughts at all about doing that. She just felt that if all the other
organizations that are using buildings owned by the Town are not getting any money (the Theatre is the only
organization that gets use of the building plus all the benefits plus cash). She added that she would like to hear
from the rest of the Council on this.
Councilmember Yates said that he is a fiscal conservative and very big on having a business model and noted that
his entire campaign was run in the same way but he too believes in getting all of the facts. He commented on his
real estate experience and stated that the comps provided by the Mayor are fairly accurate but his next question is
do they have a policy, a procedure or criteria as to how the Town gives out money. He said they are giving out
money and that should definitely be a discussion but how do they do this. He added that right now all they have
is their General Plan and their Strategic Plan and the Strategic Plan is pretty black and white (he read from a
section in the Strategic Plan relative to supporting quality, lifelong learning opportunities and cultural assets that
enrich our lives and partner to provide activities). He stated the opinion that the horse is out of the barn -- for
them to cut now is arbitrary and he believes this is a policy issue and moving forward they need to come up with a
set policy, perhaps at their Retreat, with a set criteria that dictates at what level they are even going to consider
giving and if they do consider giving what is the criteria of that gift. He added that although you can argue either
side right now it is arbitrary -- they started giving money out and it was arbitrary and so for them to cut now
would also be arbitrary. He stated that he hates to minimize this but right now to get into the details of how they
spend their money is impossible but he would appreciate receiving at least a budget when they do apply so that
they can see exactly what is being subsidized. He added that he appreciates the work that Mayor Kavanagh has
done on this but there is nothing here that says they are not legitimately following the rules and they need to have
a policy,procedure and criteria in place in order to make those kind of determinations.
Councilmember Hansen agreed with Councilmember Yates' comments and said it really is a policy decision
because the Town has supported community groups since its incorporation. She noted that they started out as
Special Benefits and became Community Benefit programs but there was always something in place that gave the
Town the ability support the community and help it be the type of community they wanted it to be. She advised
that the first year she served on the Council they put together a committee to look at the contracts and see if there
could be dedicated funding that would go towards the different areas. She stated that it was difficult and they
never really finished that discussion and every year they seem to come up against the same thing. She said they
just can't pull the rug out from under organizations that they have been partners with for so long and say this year
we are not going to do it anymore. She added that they at least have to provide some sort of notice that we are
really going to study this and see where we are going as a community.
Councilmember Hansen stated that this needs even more than the annual Council Retreat, and because this is a
policy issue, she believes it deserves its own little mini-Retreat to really get into the nitty gritty of it so that
everyone can be comfortable with it if tax dollars are spent. She pointed out that the Town is not giving money
away,it is buying a service not provided by the Town and they are telling them we want something back for this.
She further stated that when the Community Service program started it was really directed towards youths and
what Parks &Recreation was not doing and that is when the youth productions began and the Boys & Girls Club
— everything geared towards youth. She added that they might have slipped away from that over the years and
maybe they want to refocus on that but that would be done in the way the contracts are written up and the Council
(by can be very specific on what they want those dollars to be spent on. She said that she agrees that this needs a lot
more community discussion and obviously people feel strongly on both sides so the Council needs to really dig
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deep into this and decide where they want to go as a community. She stated that this year she believes they
should go with the recommendation with the caveat that this is going to have a lot more discussion as they move
forward.
Councilmember Elkie commended Ms. Stasik,the Theatre and the group for all of the great things that they have
done for the community and for getting everyone out here this evening to voice their comments and opinions. He
said that he has been on the Council for two years and has volunteered during that time to serve on the Budget
Committee and has become intimately aware of the budget and the numbers and long term looking at what are we
going to do with the Town and how they are going to pay for the things they want to do. He added that when he
brought up the discussion on the service contracts,those contracts consisted of the Theatre,the Boys&Girls Club
and the Food Bank. He stated that it was never his intention to directly target the Theatre -- it was meant to be a
philosophical discussion about what the Town should and should not be funding with tax dollars. He said that
one of the things that is very important, and former Councilmember Hutchinson indicated that, is the difficulties
associated with achieving a balanced budget, particularly during difficult economic times. He stressed the
importance of everyone knowing where the Town is financially. He stated that last year they heard that the Town
paid off Town Hall and that sends the message that the Town must be flush with money. There were also
discussions about money that is going to be spent along Avenue of the Fountain and said that money that will be
used for that are dedicated funds and cannot be used for other purposes.
Councilmember Elkie further advised that he always looks at how they are going to be able to pay for the things
that they need to,have -- infrastructure, roads,public safety, etc. He reported that based on the reports provided
by staff, the Town has not been maintaining its roads the way they should have been because of the fiscal
downturn and they are close to$1 million in shortfall to maintain the roads in the manner in which they should be.
He added that they talked about having a road bond and a lot of communities do that but they all know what the
results of the election were so they as Councilmembers have to determine how they are going to balance the
budget long term and how they are going to take care of the things that they need to take care of. He discussed ,44)
staff cuts that were made during the last few years and the fact that the budget was cut in half and said that is the
perspective he is coming from as far as the Town is concerned. He said that the Theatre is going to be there
regardless of what their decision is because it is the heart and soul of the community. He discussed contract cuts
that were made last year including the Chamber of Commerce and at that time he said that the community
contracts have to be looked at whether or not funding is going to be available in the future and perhaps look at
other funding. He said that he has always supported the Theatre and would not advocate selling the building or
anything like that but he is not afraid to bring up things that they need to talk about and if they talk about that and
they make a decision to continue, reduce or increase the funding at least they are discussing it and hopefully
something positive will come out of this.
Mayor Kavanagh advised that she thinks it is also important to keep in mind the taxpayers and the fact that they
are splitting the bill on all of this. She said that on the one hand,when they were giving out large sums of money
in earlier fiscal years they were also putting a primary property tax on the ballot and in 2011-12 they considered
cutting the police because they didn't have enough money(they were going to cut one beat). She added that they
were also considering a telecommunications tax and meanwhile they were still giving out $72,000. She pointed
out that the taxpayers are also looking at what the Council is doing and are asking how can you on the one hand
say we need a tax and on the other hand give my money away. She noted that they have an obligation to the
taxpayers to use their money wisely and they expect it to be used for roads,fire,police,emergency services and to
run the government. She added that sometimes people say that$72,000 is not a lot of money but$72,000 is three
part-time positions in the Town. She said that Town staff did not get raises for a long time but asked them to look
at the salaries that their taxes went to pay.
Mayor Kavanagh commented that at one time the Theatre was more of a voluntary operation and perhaps they
have to look at getting back to being more that way and not so much salaried positions. She added that she
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understands there have to be some salaried positions in organizations such as the museum that has a part-time
director but they don't have anything else. She said that they had one person working in the office but then they
couldn't afford that so they had to let that person go. She advised that sometimes it is very difficult to say to the
taxpayers that the Council is being responsible with their money when we also say now we have to tax you
because we don't have enough money. She stated that one of the arguments when the road bond went down was
that the people said to the Council that they didn't trust them with their money. She asked how they could win
back the trust of the citizens if they see that the Council is doing something with their money that they never told
us they could do. She stressed the importance of determining what the Town's core services are and what the
functions of government are --namely,the basic services to keep this government going. She said that she thinks
their staff is cut to the bone and when you think of the money that was spent on the Theatre over the last eight
years also think about how many jobs could have been saved. She added that right now they are funding jobs for
the Community Theatre but the funding for their own Town staff is down to the bare bones. She emphasized the
importance of also looking at the perception of the taxpayers.
The Mayor advised that a lot of people came here this evening to speak and many of them said that the Theatre
has to step up to the plate as well. She noted that the Museum started an endowment and they did so because they
had to -- they weren't getting any money from the government. She said that organizations go out and do golf
tournaments and all kinds of fundraisers and they don't stop until they have enough revenue coming in to cover
their expenses. She added that that is what they expect of organizations and reiterated that this is the only group
that gets money and a building and there are a lot of groups out there that would like to have a building. She
pointed out that they have a Rotary and when they come to the Community Center they have to pay rent to use the
room -- she asked why they aren't renting them the room for $1.00. She noted that the Rotary gave the Town a
splash park and they do great things for the Town. She said that if any of the organizations in Town want to use
the facilities they have to pay rent -- they get a reduced rate but they have to pay rent. She asked why certain
groups are privileged over others.
Vice Mayor Leger said that he resents the notion that he is not a good steward of the taxpayers'dollars and added
that the decisions he makes as part of the Council are not arbitrary -- they are driven by a community driven
Strategic Plan --the voice of the citizens who have told us what they as a Town would like to be and the type of
amenities they would like to have. He stated that maybe this conversation would not be occurring if they looked
at the Parks &Recreation budget and they had a line item called Theatre. He said they are not discussing all of
the other recreational programs that are currently in the Parks & Recreation department's budget. He added that
this is a tourism driven Town and they have just approved over$100,000 for tourism and he supports that because
he believes it is critical to the Town. He stated that if you were to look at that in the same way, $96,000 goes
towards salaries and he realizes it is labor intensive. He added that they need to decide whether this is a value
adding service to the community that can be done by a non-profit group more effectively than the Town. He
reiterated that his actions are driven by the citizen driven Strategic Plan and said that he just went through a recall
election and received significant support from the citizens so he thinks there is some trust out their regarding his
decisions. He stated that they are making this a lot more complex than it needs to be and added that he has heard
that this is not the role of the government. He asked who is to say funding these amenities for the Town is not the
role of local government -- they are a municipal corporation and a municipal corporation, unlike a private
corporation,is not in it for profit.
The Vice Mayor noted that they have reduced community contracts by 40% as they moved through the recession
and they are now at a point where he feels it is important to level off and evaluate the services. He pointed out
that at the Council Retreats they always start with the Strategic Plan and they drill it down and the type of services
they are talking about here with their community partners are many that the residents have and are asking for. He
read the Mission Statement of the Council and emphasized that these are quality of life issues. He further stated
that the last time they did a scientific survey by an objective outsider 80%of the respondents said that they moved
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to Fountain Hills because it is family friendly and its small town character. He added that he personally believes
that they are better than this and they should work harder to do these types of things because these are the types of
things that the citizens are asking for. He stated that it costs a small percentage of the overall budget to provide
these services and pointed out that he is fiscally conservative.
Vice Mayor Leger declared a point of order and said that they do have a large budget to vote on this evening and
he respects the comments that have been made and the analysis, some of which he has gone through himself. He
stated that he would just like to clarify where they are at in the process and pointed out that they have a motion
and a second on the table to adopt the budget. He suggested that someone put a motion on the table to amend the
motion,particularly on this item since there seems to be opposition to it,and then move on.
Councilmember Brown advised that he agrees 100%with Councilmember Hansen's comments and believes that
they need to get this behind them,bring it up at a Retreat and find a resolve that will be permanent. He added that
he wants to talk a little bit about the building and in 2001-02 he and another person built the main stage out of the
old original Community Center. He stated that the Center was virtually ready to be condemned when they went
in and did some work--they put in the fire protection system and built the stages and everything that needed to be
done. He said that if they didn't have someone in the buildings actually maintaining them currently those
buildings would deteriorate (unoccupied buildings fall apart). He added that they have to give the Theatre some
credit because they have maintained the buildings so at least they are not falling down and regardless of whether
they are in the buildings or not, whoever said that they have $86,000 worth of repairs coming up, those repairs
would have to happen whether or not the Theatre is utilizing the building or not. He commented that as long as
the economy is strapping the parents of this Town to the point where they don't have the money to take their kids
to do things kids should do, amenities such as the Boys & Girls Club, the Theatre and the Workshops are all
needed safe havens. He added that the Theatre,time and time again,becomes the subject of conversation for the
Town's youths and, as discussed, they have so little for their youths to do. He said that at this point in time they
should not take anything else away from the youths.
Councilmember Hansen stated that all of the speakers tonight brought up some very good points and it reminds
them that the Theatre is part of the Town's economic development --people who come to Fountain Hills to go to
the Theatre eat in our restaurants and spend their money at a variety of local businesses. She added that they are
getting a return on these dollars and"salary" is not a negative word, like Councilmember Leger said,because our
children go to school and the teachers are paid and it is the same with the Theatre --the youths are learning a lot
and it would be hard to do that with volunteers who generally do not possess the level of expertise required. She
said that the important thing is to make sure that they can demonstrate accountability to the residents and prove
that the dollars are purchasing a very worthwhile service.
Councilmember Elide commented that based on the late hour and the fact that they are talking about
approximately$72,000 out of an approximate $31 million budget, he would MOVE to maintain the Community
Service Contracts (all four at the listed current recommended levels) contingent on Councilmember Hansen's
comments and request that we have discussion during one of the Council's Retreats and delve down on these
further and Councilmember Yates SECONDED the motion.
Mayor Kavanagh AMENDED THE MOTION to state that the Council will reinstate the contracts and the
Community Theatre can certainly continue to use the building but they will not supply the$72,240.
The amended motion DIED for lack of a second.
Mayor Kavanagh called for a vote on the main amendment.
In response to a question from Vice Mayor Leger, Mr. McGuire provided clarification on the main motion. He
said that typically the Council makes individual motions on the various items to provide staff with clear direction.
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Councilmember Brown Aye
Vice Mayor Leger Aye
L Councilmember Elide Aye
Councilmember Yates Aye
Councilmember Hansen Aye
Councilmember Dickey Abstain
Mayor Kavanagh Nay
The motion CARRIED by majority vote of those voting(5-1)with Mayor Kavanagh voting Nay.
Councilmember Hansen stated that Mr. Buchanan had stated that he had some new initiatives included in the
presentation and he was nice enough to jump forward because there were so many people who wanted to speak on
the Theatre. She noted that at the first meeting in May they talked about a revised schedule to adopt the budget
and that included an additional meeting next week with final approval taking place at the second meeting in June.
She said she is getting the feeling that tonight they were moving forward and trying to adopt the whole thing
without providing that other opportunity. She added that they could provide specific direction on individual items
if they move forward and hold the additional meeting.
Mr. Buchanan informed the Council that staff is prepared to hold another meeting if that is the desire of the
Council.
Councilmember Hansen stated that if they did that Mr. Buchanan could go through the entire presentation and if
there were any things that the Council wanted to bring up during that presentation there would be an opportunity
to do so.
Councilmember Dickey returned to the dais at 9:30 PM.
Mr. Buchanan agreed and added that he knows that there are questions regarding other programs that are included
in the presentation and he didn't know if they wanted to go through them tonight or pick up that discussion next
Tuesday(June 12th).
Councilmember Elide advised that his motion had been to accept the Community Service Contracts at the
proposed funding level (all four) and Councilmember Dickey just returned to the dais and she did not have an
opportunity to hear the discussion or provide any input on the other three contracts and it was not his intention to
deprive her of the opportunity to discuss those other contracts.
Mr. McGuire informed the Council that because those other contracts are also part of the overall budget they will
still be able to comment on them as they go through the overall budget process.
Mayor Kavanagh said that they have a motion to approve the overall budget as presented and she would like to
know what happens to that.
Mr.McGuire replied that that motion is still on the table and has not been acted upon.
Councilmember Hansen MOVED to continue this discussion to Tuesday, June 12, 2012 and Councilmember
Brown SECONDED the motion.
There was no additional discussion on this item and a roll call vote was taken with the following results:
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Councilmember Yates Aye
Vice Mayor Leger Aye
Councilmember Brown Aye
Councilmember Dickey Aye
Councilmember Hansen Aye
Councilmember Elide Aye
Mayor Kavanagh Aye
The motion CARRIED UNANIMOUSLY(7-0).
AGENDA ITEM #3 - CONSIDERATION OF RESOLUTION 2012-18, PROVIDING GENERAL
DIRECTION ON POLICY ADMINISTRATION OF THE ADOPTED BY 2012-13 BUDGET,ADOPTING
THE TOWN OF FOUNTAIN HILLS ORGANIZATION CHART, FY2012-13 AUTHORIZED FULL-
TIME EQUIVALENTS(FTE'S)WITH ASSOCIATED JOB DESCRIPTIONS AND THE FY2012-13 PAY
PLAN.
Councilmember Yates MOVED to continue consideration of Resolution 2012-18 to the June 12, 2012 Regular
Council meeting and Councilmember Hansen SECONDED the motion, which CARRIED UNANIMOUSLY
(7-0).
AGENDA ITEM#4—ADJOURNMENT.
Councilmember Yates MOVED that the Council adjourn the meeting and Councilmember Brown SECONDED
the motion,which CARRIED UNANIMOUSLY by those present(7-0).The meeting adjourned at 9:32 p.m.
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TOWN OF FOUNTAIN HILLS
Linda M.K anagh,Mayor
ATTEST AND
P PARED BY:
Bevelyn J e er,Town Clerk
CERTIFICATION
I hereby certify that the foregoing minutes are a true and correct copy of the minutes of the Special Session held
by the Town Council of Fountain Hills in the Town Hall Council Chambers on the 12th day of June, 2012. I
further certify that the meeting was duly called and that a quorum was present.
Dated this 2nd day of August, 2012.
cie
Bevelyn J. B der, wn Clerk
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